[Andyjw]

I know I've said it on these forums before, but my personal belief is that at least 25% of the dead deer pictures we see online are taken in some illegal manner, be it baiting, trespassing, jacklighting, out of season, weapon not in season, etc.

That wouldnt surprise me in the least bit to be honest. Had a jackass buddy back in the day that use to shoot sum really nice buck. Well his in-laws sold their farm and he had to find a new place to hunt. He asked my parents for permission to hunt their property. Turns out he baited them deer in year round. Pissed me right off. He no longer hunts our property and surrounding property. I was so mad that he would put everyone's hunting that hunted out property at risk of being closed off or worse, having the pgc find out and rope off the area for no hunting. Any idiot can bait deer in and shoot them. I still get salty about that whole situation.

 

[whil e kioti]

You can shoot a deer, tag it, cut the head off and walk away. That is not illegal.
But you can't find a dead buck you didn't shoot, tag it and keep the antlers. That's illegal.
Not sure which one you meant though.

The first...but more to the point...just saying that finding a deer in that condition doesn't necessarily mean it was poached.

 

[Bigbrownie]

I think the outlaw mentality has changed a lot over the years. Back 70-80 years ago, my uncles and Grandfather killed a lot of deer. Many for the meat, and some they sold. ( There was a good market for bucks after WW2….a lot of new camps, they wanted a deer to take home ). But none of the killing was for bragging rights , it was for meat or for money for the family.

Today, you see guys lusting after big antlers. And it drives some pretty crazy behavior. And the kill for thrill guys who drive around and whack random deer….that would have been unheard of in the 1950’s and 60’s .

 

[jimbridger]

I thought we were told on here to not worry about the loopholes in any of the modern methods being implemented because most people are good and will simply follow the rules.

96% of nothing shouldn't have much impact.

96% of the minority is still 96%

Do not mistake the percentage of one sub set as the percentage of the whole. Waugh!

 

[elk yinzer]

I think the outlaw mentality has changed a lot over the years. Back 70-80 years ago, my uncles and Grandfather killed a lot of deer. Many for the meat, and some they sold. ( There was a good market for bucks after WW2….a lot of new camps, they wanted a deer to take home ). But none of the killing was for bragging rights , it was for meat or for money for the family.

Today, you see guys lusting after big antlers. And it drives some pretty crazy behavior. And the kill for thrill guys who drive around and whack random deer….that would have been unheard of in the 1950’s and 60’s .

We have it pretty good arguing about innane stuff like trail cams and drones, really. We were dealing with all kinda problems that threatened our daily survival and regularly killed children not that many generations ago. People just scratched out a living. Deer were just walking food back then.

Cavemen drew trophies on caves. I don't buy for a second mankind ever lost his appreciation for fine specimens. There just werent many around for a spell.

 

[NECK SHOT]

Well I’m sure the number of tags and opportunities (seasons and length) has made some more honest than they would be if was the way it was 20-40 plus years ago.
When it was one deer and done….you had a family of 5-7 to feed one deer didn’t last to long.
The community that I grew up in there were guys that provided deer meat for people.
I remember being at someone’s house as a kid and someone dropping a big tin can filled with deer meat off. I don’t know the particulars on if it was tagged or not or even remember if it was deer season. The family that received it was very happy about it.

 

[rugered]

I think the outlaw mentality has changed a lot over the years. Back 70-80 years ago, my uncles and Grandfather killed a lot of deer. Many for the meat, and some they sold. ( There was a good market for bucks after WW2….a lot of new camps, they wanted a deer to take home ). But none of the killing was for bragging rights , it was for meat or for money for the family.

Today, you see guys lusting after big antlers. And it drives some pretty crazy behavior. And the kill for thrill guys who drive around and whack random deer….that would have been unheard of in the 1950’s and 60’s .

I remember stories up in Clarence and Moshannon about locals stealing bucks off of meat poles and selling them to company camps. Back then the big companies invited customers to camp as a marketing tool. Didn't want to send them home without a trophy.

I remember a story about the company buying a bunch of tame turkeys to butcher for guys to take home. One guy wanted to shoot his to make it legit. He missed and it ran off never to be seen again!

 

[Bigbrownie]

I remember stories up in Clarence and Moshannon about locals stealing bucks off of meat poles and selling them to company camps. Back then the big companies invited customers to camp as a marketing tool. Didn't want to send them home without a trophy.

I remember a story about the company buying a bunch of tame turkeys to butcher for guys to take home. One guy wanted to shoot his to make it legit. He missed and it ran off never to be seen again!

Selling deer was pretty common years ago. Wasn’t a lot of ways to make money on the Mountaintop…..working in the mines or cutting timber.

Both US Steel and Alcoa had camps out off the Ridge Road. ( 144 ). USS opened their camp in October, and it was occupied through mid December. They had a handyman, bartender and cook on site. My Great Uncle ( Grandfather’s brother ) was the cook. A lot of the “sports” ( that what they called hunters ) were customers, and they came just to play cards and drink. They barely hunted. But they wanted a buck to take home. My G uncle would feel them out for what they wanted, and my Grandfather would start hunting on Thanksgiving night. His brother in law had a tavern , ( The Star Garden), that had a walk in cooler. The bucks hung in there till the “ sports” were ready to leave. My Grandfather would haul them out to camp, put their tags on them, and tie them down on the hoods or trunks. In the late 40s early 50s, he‘d get anywhere from $15 for a rag horn, up to $50 for a trophy buck. You could also sell them grouse for 25 cents apiece.

I recall my uncle telling me he killed his first deer, a four point, when he was 14. My Grandfather sold it for $15.

 

[dpms]

I know I've said it on these forums before, but my personal belief is that at least 25% of the dead deer pictures we see online are taken in some illegal manner, be it baiting, trespassing, jacklighting, out of season, weapon not in season, etc.

So either me or wexfordbowhunter is a poacher, then. There are 4 dead deer in the deer contest thread.

 

[WOL]

With as much poaching as there is, can you imagine what the deer numbers would be without the poachers. We'd be infested.

 

[Patrapper01]

With as much poaching as there is, can you imagine what the deer numbers would be without the poachers. We'd be infested.

We are infested; the old farmers kept deer thinned out back in the day.

 

[Dusdaddy]

The number does sound pretty ridiculous. So if you are standing there at camp with 9 other hunters and you, each with a deer, they all did it illegally because you didn't?

This says "poaching is any illegal taking". If you squeeze the trigger 1 minute early/late, have one square inch less orange on, forget to sign your license, etc. then you took a deer illegally. It doesn't mean poaching is a barn with 20 hanging or a whole camp of hunters are out all night with flashlights.

 

[WOL]

or a whole camp of hunters are out all night with flashlights.

Screw that!!!! That's when we play cards.

 

[rugered]

Selling deer was pretty common years ago. Wasn’t a lot of ways to make money on the Mountaintop…..working in the mines or cutting timber.

Both US Steel and Alcoa had camps out off the Ridge Road. ( 144 ). USS opened their camp in October, and it was occupied through mid December. They had a handyman, bartender and cook on site. My Great Uncle ( Grandfather’s brother ) was the cook. A lot of the “sports” ( that what they called hunters ) were customers, and they came just to play cards and drink. They barely hunted. But they wanted a buck to take home. My G uncle would feel them out for what they wanted, and my Grandfather would start hunting on Thanksgiving night. His brother in law had a tavern , ( The Star Garden), that had a walk in cooler. They bucks hung in there till the “ sports” were ready to leave. My Grandfather would haul them out to camp, put their tags on them, and tie them down on the hoods or trunks. In the late 40s early 50s, he‘d get anywhere from $15 for a rag horn, up to $50 for a trophy buck. You could also sell them grouse for 25 cents apiece.

I recall my uncle telling me he killed his first deer, a four point, when he was 14. My Grandfather sold it for $15.

I got on and off the bus at the Star Garden. On the old maps it's shown as Star School but I don't remember anyone talking about it being a school.

The brick yard had a camp out on 144 as well. My dad worked there in the office his whole working life after the war.

 

[bradford13]

When I was in college we hunted off of Ridge Rd.

 

[Bigbrownie]

I got on and off the bus at the Star Garden. On the old maps it's shown as Star School but I don't remember anyone talking about it being a school.

The brick yard had a camp out on 144 as well. My dad worked there in the office his whole working life after the war.

The bar was an old schoolhouse . My great uncle Bill Preslovich ( also my Godfather ) opened the Star Garden after WW2.

 

[Jericho]

Back in the 2 weeks of antlered and 2 days of antlerless deer season, my cousins husband would walk a couple of hundred yards behind his house and shoot the first deer he saw on the first day of buck season. Of course, most of the time the first deer he saw was a doe. He wasnt a big hunter, but enjoyed venison. He did this on his own property and processed it himself. His wife finally made him stop doing it. He left this world a few years ago, so hopefully I havent riled up the internet police.....................

 

[R. S. B.]

I honestly think that poaching in PENN is not as bad as it used to be back in the 70s and 80s

I agree with that statement. I started with the Game Commission back in the mid 70's and poaching was a real issue back then. Back then it was one deer per year, and you were done. At least done legally. For many, maybe even most, one deer a year simply wasn't enough. For some it was the meat they were after and others it was that they didn't want to end their hunting.

Back then if I found a local archer with a dead deer there was almost a certainty it was not going to be tagged. I higher percentage of the camp people tagged their archery kills but it was not at all uncommon to catch them reusing the tag on another deer or using someone else's license.

During the firearms deer season untagged deer and multiple kills in a season were very common, even among people who were normally not of a criminal nature.

On fall and even some summer weekends the camps would be filled with hunters and a lot of them were going to take a deer back home with them. There were nights when you would hear as much shooting as you would hear the second day of buck season.

I remember one weekend night a deputy and I were totally frustrated because we didn't catch our first poacher of the night until the 17th shot. Then while we were writing them up we watched a vehicle a few hundred yards away spotlighting and shooting. We were too tied up to even go after them.

By the time I retired, in 2012, you were lucky to even see a spot lighter out at night and I wouldn't hear as much night shooting during the entire fall as what I would hear in one night back in the 70's and 80's. When hunters could get more deer tags they simply didn't need to risk getting caught poaching. Now it seems the people killing extras or illegal deer are mostly after the big bucks or extra bucks simply because don't want a big buck or they aren't willing to be finished buck hunting for the year.

Dick Bodenhorn

 

[TrashPanda]

When I was younger and we would go out spotting at night, I recall my grandfather saying more than once that the deer were acting like someone was shooting at them. At times, as soon as you would turn the light on the deer would be running for the woods. That was back in the 80's before you could get even a second tag of any kind.

 

[jimbridger]

I agree with that statement. I started with the Game Commission back in the mid 70's and poaching was a real issue back then. Back then it was one deer per year, and you were done. At least done legally. For many, maybe even most, one deer a year simply wasn't enough. For some it was the meat they were after and others it was that they didn't want to end their hunting.

Back then if I found a local archer with a dead deer there was almost a certainty it was not going to be tagged. I higher percentage of the camp people tagged their archery kills but it was not at all uncommon to catch them reusing the tag on another deer or using someone else's license.

During the firearms deer season untagged deer and multiple kills in a season were very common, even among people who were normally not of a criminal nature.

On fall and even some summer weekends the camps would be filled with hunters and a lot of them were going to take a deer back home with them. There were nights when you would hear as much shooting as you would hear the second day of buck season.

I remember one weekend night a deputy and I were totally frustrated because we didn't catch our first poacher of the night until the 17th shot. Then while we were writing them up we watched a vehicle a few hundred yards away spotlighting and shooting. We were too tied up to even go after them.

By the time I retired, in 2012, you were lucky to even see a spot lighter out at night and I wouldn't hear as much night shooting during the entire fall as what I would hear in one night back in the 70's and 80's. When hunters could get more deer tags they simply didn't need to risk getting caught poaching. Now it seems the people killing extras or illegal deer are mostly after the big bucks or extra bucks simply because don't want a big buck or they aren't willing to be finished buck hunting for the year.

Dick Bodenhorn

Well there was always the "cabin meat" deer. RSB tell us about the old timer you had at your tours that showed us the antler collection he shot back in the day. Also tell us what he said when he showed multiple antlers for the same year. IIRC the statement was none were ever wasted and all were used for a good cause. Waugh!