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savages makes the gun it is coming out in May they claiming over 3000 feet a second , whole package with acura trigger is around $ 300.00 , I dont need a 1000 yard wodchuck gun just wanted it to teach my son how to hunt he is eight this would his first woodchuck rifle.

any input would help thank you.
 

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I did some reading and watched some youtube videos on it. I liked what I saw and the ballistics out to 250yds. I ordered one at a local gun store back in February. I can't wait to actually get it in my hand. I think it will be excellent for groundhogs and fox with enough left over to put down a coyote with a decently placed shot. Time will tell but should be excellent for fox and groundhogs.
 

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I want one too. They didn't plan the release that well imo, though. There was a lot of excitement after the SHOT show but a long delay getting the guns to market.
 

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Very poor marketing.You know they are gonna lose sales with the delay as the impulse buyers realize while waitin that they don,t need or really want it.
 
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I saw it in a magazine with a coyote pictured. Highly unethical to me. Now way unless a head shot. I won't even take a body shot on a coyote with my .17 Fireball.
 

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Seeking_Coyotes2 said:
I saw it in a magazine with a coyote pictured. Highly unethical to me. Now way unless a head shot. I won't even take a body shot on a coyote with my .17 Fireball.
Why no faith in your gun?
 
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Just from experience shooting a few with it. Might use on a western coyote but not these big east dogs.
 

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Springer Rage said:
I want one too. They didn't plan the release that well imo, though. There was a lot of excitement after the SHOT show but a long delay getting the guns to market.
I am sure it had nothing to do with the sudden surge in ammo demand. Since Winnie is the ONLY ammo manufacturer it makes perfect sense to me that Savage didn't need to rush it to market. What was supposed to happen was Winnie was supposed to have that ammo out late March, early April. I have had it on my MidwayUSA wish list since late Feb, early March. I have watched the expected release date go from late April, early May, late June, mid August. Now last week the 20gr was moved forward back to June. Also if anyone read about the release of the rifle Savage has ALWAYS said 2nd quarter. it is still slated for 2nd quarter release. When I get mine I will let you know.

Now last year the big hubbub and buzz was the .17 Hornet. Hornady did a great job promoting it. I was talking to Savage last Spring trying to find out when the M25 was shipping in 17H, they were talking late August. I asked if they were building the .204 & 22H and I was told they were slated to build before the 17H. I ended up buying the .204 and I personally didn't expect to see a 17H until Christmas. Now late August, early September one of the managers I know at the local Dick's told me they had Model 25's in 17H. Mind you I was their 1st sale of a M25 ever at that store. I asked if they had the thumbhole and they didn't and that is what I was waiting for. On the 28th of December my local gun shop presented me with my object of desire, pretty much right on schedule. They tell me they have 6 B.Mags on order. I told them I want one and that I have money set aside for one and that I might take 2. We'll see when they get them.
 

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Seeking_Coyotes2 said:
Just from experience shooting a few with it. Might use on a western coyote but not these big east dogs.
The 17 Rem Mag is useless on animals that size too. It's OK to be the fastest production center fire (4250fps) but the 20gr bullet carries no inertia. Perhaps a 25gr would help. The Hornady 204R is 4225 with 32gr and 400lbs/ft more energy and I question if it is good enough to instantly kill a fair sized coyote at over 200 yards.
 

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OK I contacted Winchester yesterday to inquire about a "real time" release on the .17 WSM ammo and they said it should start shipping the end of the month and be in stores by Mid May. If I had not mentioned it already Savage should have the B.Mags in the stores by Mid May.
 

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Plinkin said:
Seeking_Coyotes2 said:
Just from experience shooting a few with it. Might use on a western coyote but not these big east dogs.
The 17 Rem Mag is useless on animals that size too. It's OK to be the fastest production center fire (4250fps) but the 20gr bullet carries no inertia. Perhaps a 25gr would help. The Hornady 204R is 4225 with 32gr and 400lbs/ft more energy and I question if it is good enough to instantly kill a fair sized coyote at over 200 yards.
Maybe you should try killing coyotes with some of those useless rifles, before you proclaim thier uselessness. Just a thought...
 

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Borden811 said:
Maybe you should try killing coyotes with some of those useless rifles, before you proclaim their uselessness. Just a thought...
Well that was a thought wasted. Tell you what though, as soon as a coyote comes across my path while I am varmint hunting with my .204 I'll give it a try.

It is true that I have no experience shooting a .17 Rem (anything) but a good friend of mine does have and from his experience the .17 Rem is NOT a 1 shot 1 kill coyote gun. Believe me when I say I am sure he is a much better shot than anyone posting in this thread.
 

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On the Coyote Gods forum the weapon of choice is the 17 Rem. These guys are fur takers and and highly prize the 17 cal. I know that coyotes are tough but I can not believe that statement "the 17 Rem is NOT a 1 shot 1 kill coyote gun". May be a 17 HMR not a 17 Remmy.
 

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Grey Dog said:
On the Coyote Gods forum the weapon of choice is the 17 Rem. These guys are fur takers and and highly prize the 17 cal. I know that coyotes are tough but I can not believe that statement "the 17 Rem is NOT a 1 shot 1 kill coyote gun". May be a 17 HMR not a 17 Remmy.
Certainly not an HMR. Although I am a big fan of the HMR and I have seen it do things that I didn't think possible I wouldn't think of using one on that size of critter unless it was well inside 100 yards.

My friend who told me the statement I parroted has owned many guns in many calibers. He was a "wildcatter" from way back and has built some interesting guns and calibers although he admits some were not useful.

Recently he told me how he built a mouse and rat gun out of an air rifle barrel. It shot .177 pellets and its charge was a 209 primer. He said inside of 50 feet it was devastating on critters but the 209's burned hot enough to melt the tail of the pellet thus making it inconsistent.

I trust what he tells me to be BS free. I cannot deny the experiences of others who testify to the effectiveness of their specific guns or cartridges or his experience or yours or others. I only offer advise biased on what I would do.

Would I buy a new 17 WSM with the idea of hunting coyotes in mind. No. Would I buy one because I love rim fires and I get the warm fuzzies thinking about the fastest rim fire round out there, uh huh.

Would I throw down the better part of $1000 for a 17 Rem Mag or 17 Fireball to hunt coyotes? No. If I was really truly wanting a 17 Rem then that is a different story.

As I have said before here and other places, the 17WSM is an inexpensive way to get into Varmint hunting. Even though the rim fire round may end up being more expensive that every other regular rim fire except the 5mm Rem Mag you still can buy a lot of 17WSM before you can make up the difference in price on a 204, 222, 223, 22-250 etc bolt action. Even buying any of those calibers used.

I am not always right but I am less wrong that I am right. My opinions are sometimes not popular but that happens at times when they are fact based.
 

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Plinkin said:
Borden811 said:
Maybe you should try killing coyotes with some of those useless rifles, before you proclaim their uselessness. Just a thought...
It is true that I have no experience shooting a .17 Rem (anything) but a good friend of mine does have and from his experience the .17 Rem is NOT a 1 shot 1 kill coyote gun. Believe me when I say I am sure he is a much better shot than anyone posting in this thread.
Pardon me but anyone on a message board saying they know a guy that knows someones brother that's a better shot than anyone on here.. I tend to get skeptical.

with that being said, I did get get to see this gun up close at a gun show out west and I will be buying it as soon as it hits my local dealers shelf targeting fox/yote/cats
 

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spangler2k3 said:
with that being said, I did get get to see this gun up close at a gun show out west and I will be buying it as soon as it hits my local dealers shelf targeting fox/yote/cats
I also will be buying one (or 2) ASAP. So let us know what to expect when it hits a coyote. It'll be a rodent rifle for me.
 
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Plinkin said:
Seeking_Coyotes2 said:
Just from experience shooting a few with it. Might use on a western coyote but not these big east dogs.
The 17 Rem Mag is useless on animals that size too. It's OK to be the fastest production center fire (4250fps) but the 20gr bullet carries no inertia. Perhaps a 25gr would help. The Hornady 204R is 4225 with 32gr and 400lbs/ft more energy and I question if it is good enough to instantly kill a fair sized coyote at over 200 yards.
I use the .25 grain Berger's in my Fireball and they don't do the job. Will never shoot the Fireball at a coyote again unless a head or neck shot fairly close. Have shot some Kimber Gold 30 grain bullets out of my Fireball at Fox and they were noticeably more destructive. Everybody kept telling me how good the .17's were for coyotes...wish I did not believe them and went right to the .243 or a .220 swift or .22-250. That is just my .02 experience...yours may vary. ;-)
 

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Seeking_Coyotes2 said:
I use the .25 grain Berger's in my Fireball and they don't do the job. Will never shoot the Fireball at a coyote again unless a head or neck shot fairly close. Have shot some Kimber Gold 30 grain bullets out of my Fireball at Fox and they were noticeably more destructive. Everybody kept telling me how good the .17's were for coyotes...wish I did not believe them and went right to the .243 or a .220 swift or .22-250. That is just my .02 experience...yours may vary. ;-)
I have heard the 22 Hornet works well, again I have no coyote hands on hunting experience. My 22 Hornet is very accurate and I know I can hit a woodchuck sized target with it out to 200 yards. I have not had any success past 200 but I did try last Friday, unfortunately it was 85+ yards past 200 not just a smidge. I have read of guys using the 22H on whitetails in states where it is legal. I can't say I would do that myself though.
 
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