The HuntingPA.com Outdoor Community banner
1 - 18 of 18 Posts

·
Administrator
Joined
·
30,457 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
You're sound asleep when you hear a thump outside your bedroom door.
Half-awake, and nearly paralyzed with fear, you hear muffled whispers.
At least two people have broken into your house and are moving your way.

With your heart pumping, you reach down beside your bed and pick up your
shotgun. You rack a shell into the chamber, then inch toward the door
and open it.

In the darkness, you make out two shadows. One holds something that
looks like a crowbar. When the intruder brandishes it as if to strike,
you raise the shotgun and fire. The blast knocks both thugs to the
floor.

One writhes and screams while the second man crawls to the front door
and lurches outside.

As you pick up the telephone to call police, you know you're in trouble.

In your country, most guns were outlawed years before, and the few that
are privately-owned are so stringently regulated as to make them
useless.

Yours was never registered.

Police arrive and inform you that the second burglar has died. They
arrest you for First Degree Murder and Illegal Possession of a Firearm.

When you talk to your attorney, he tells you not to worry: authorities
will probably plea the case down to manslaughter.

"What kind of sentence will I get?" you ask.

"Only ten-to-twelve years," he replies, as if that's nothing. "Behave
yourself, and you'll be out in seven."

The next day, the shooting is the lead story in the local newspaper.
Somehow, you're portrayed as an eccentric vigilante while the two men
you shot are represented as choirboys. Their friends and relatives
can't find an unkind word to say about them. Buried deep down in the
article, authorities acknowledge that both "victims" have been arrested
numerous times.

But the next day's headline says it all: "Lovable Rogue Son Didn't
Deserve to Die." The thieves have been transformed from career
criminals into Robin Hood-type pranksters.

As the days wear on, the story takes wings. The national media picks it
up, then the international media. The surviving burglar has become a
folk hero.

Your attorney says the thief is preparing to sue you, and he'll probably
win.

The media publishes reports that your home has been burglarized several
times in the past and that you've been critical of local police for
their lack of effort in apprehending the suspects. After the last
break-in, you told your neighbor that you would be prepared next time.

The District Attorney uses this to allege that you were lying in wait
for the burglars.

A few months later, you go to trial. The charges haven't been reduced,
as your lawyer had so confidently predicted.

When you take the stand, your anger at the injustice of it all works
against you. Prosecutors paint a picture of you as a mean, vengeful
man. It doesn't take long for the jury to convict you of all charges.

The judge sentences you to life in prison.

This case really happened.

--------------------------------------------

On August 22, 1999, Tony Martin of Emneth, Norfolk, England, killed one
burglar and wounded a second.

In April, 2000, he was convicted and is now serving a life term in
prison.

How did it become a crime to defend one's own life in the once great
British Empire?

It started with the Pistols Act of 1903. This seemingly reasonable law
forbade selling pistols to minors or felons and established that handgun
sales were to be made only to those who had a license.

The Firearms Act of 1920 expanded licensing to include not only handguns
but all firearms except shotguns.

Later laws passed in 1953 and 1967 outlawed the carrying of any weapon
by private citizens and mandated the registration of all shotguns.

Momentum for total firearm confiscation began in earnest after the
Hungerford mass shooting in 1987. Michael Ryan, a mentally disturbed
man with a Kalashnikov rifle (AK-47), walked down the streets shooting
everyone he saw. When the smoke cleared, 17 people were dead.

The British public, already de-sensitized by eighty years of "gun
control", demanded even tougher restrictions. The seizure of all
privately owned handguns was the objective even though Ryan used a
rifle.

Nine years later, at Dunblane, Scotland, Thomas Hamilton used a
semi-automatic weapon to murder 16 children and a teacher at a public
school.

For many years, the media had portrayed all gun owners as mentally
unstable or worse, criminals. Now the press had a real kook with which
to beat up law-abiding gun owners. Day after day, week after week, the
media gave up all pretense of objectivity and demanded a total ban on
all handguns. The Dunblane Inquiry, a few months later, sealed the fate
of the few sidearms still owned by private citizens.

During the years in which the British government incrementally took away
most gun rights, the notion that a citizen had the right to armed
self-defense came to be seen as vigilantism. Authorities refused to
grant gun licenses to people who were threatened, claiming that
self-defense was no longer considered a reason to own a gun. Citizens
who shot burglars or robbers or rapists were charged while the real
criminals were released. Indeed, after the Martin shooting, a police
spokesman was quoted as saying, "We cannot have people take the law into
their own hands."

All of Martin's neighbors had been robbed numerous times, and several
elderly people were severely injured in beatings by young thugs who had
no fear of the consequences. Martin himself, a collector of antiques,
had seen most of his collection trashed or stolen by burglars.

When the Dunblane Inquiry ended, citizens who owned handguns were given
three months to turn them over to local authorities. Being good British
subjects, most people obeyed the law. The few who didn't were visited
by police and threatened with ten-year prison sentences if they didn't
comply. Police later bragged that they'd taken nearly 200,000 handguns
from private citizens.

How did the authorities know who had handguns?

The guns had been registered and licensed.

Kind of like cars. Sound familiar?


WAKE UP AMERICA! THIS IS WHY OUR FOUNDING FATHERS PUT THE SECOND
AMENDMENT IN OUR CONSTITUTION.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,634 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

This is why we have to stand together. Support organizations that can battle the anti-gun agenda on the political level. I was raised in a hunting, gun owning family. I will continue to raise my family that way. I will not give up my rights.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
675 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

It servers him right for breaking the law.
He deserves life in prison for his actions.
He took a mans life that only wanted to steal from him,
and possibly rape his woman, and rough him up.
Since the law over there states it was against the law to do this, He has no one but himself to blame.
Remember, he is a subject, not a citizen,
and as such, he has no legal reason for breaking the law.
Just my
2 Quid.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,481 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

i dont own any guns, and thats my story and im sticking to it. but i wouldnt reccomend breaking into my house.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,336 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

yes but atleast you will have free healthcare free housing and free food. you know all those basic freedoms that come with living in the new USA.

timber
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,857 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

i will take my seven.probably twelve..cause i wont behave...and come out an do it again if it happens....stay out of my house if your not invited!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,497 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

Wow.... there is only one mistake I see here! He didn't rack in another round and finish what he started!!! A lot of great American sacraficed to make sure we have the "Right to Bear Arms"! God Bless them all and their families!!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
675 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

There is a reason why England came begging the US for our help in the pre WW2 days, they did not have enough guns or subjects that knew how to use them, to ward off an invading army. Most died fighting in WW1 because there country asked them to storm German machine gun emaplacements with bolt action rifles and fixed bayonets yelling "god save the king"

There is also a reason why the USA has not been invaded since 1812, by the Brittish I might add, and that is because we have rights that Subjects do not have.
If you doubt these rights, ask any gun owner in Nevada or New Mexico why the mexican drug cartels havent invaded yet in force.

I still stand by my original post about Tony Martin of Emneth,, he had no right to protect himself, or his family with a firearm in that country.
This makes him a bad guy for breaking their law, not the good guy.
It is odd though that the Orig poster of this thread,Bcoz, did not say what the out come of the trial was, I mean, his supposedly happend in 1999 right? So here is the outcome of what happend from the al knowing, all seeing Wiki P

Tony Martin
Further information: Tony Martin (farmer)
In 1999 Tony Martin was living in an isolated farmhouse in Emneth Hungate, Norfolk, nicknamed "Bleak House". He claimed to have been burgled several times, losing £6,000 worth of furniture. Martin also complained about police inaction over the burglaries. Police sources, however, have expressed doubts that all these incidents took place.[9] On the night of 20 August 1999, two burglars - Brendon Fearon, 29, and Fred Barras, 16, entered Bleak House.[10] When confronted, they attempted to flee through a window, but were shot by Martin, Fearon in the leg, and Barras in the back. Fearon was able to leave and obtain aid from a couple that lived near the house. He was then taken into hospital, where he was treated. Martin subsequently left the farm and fled to his mother's house, where he hid the firearm. Later that evening, he arrived at a local inn and stayed for the night. Barras was later found dead on the grounds by a police dog. On 23 August 1999, Martin was charged with the murder of Barras, the attempted murder of Fearon, "wounding with intent to cause injury" to Fearon, and "possessing a firearm with intent to endanger life".[10] The jury at the trial were told that they had the option of returning a verdict of manslaughter rather than murder, if they thought that Martin "did not intend to kill or cause serious bodily harm".[11] However, they found Martin guilty of murder by a 10 to 2 majority.[12] He was sentenced to life in prison, the mandatory sentence for murder under English law.

Sounds like he got what all killers in England get when caught, Life in prison.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,309 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

roland45 said:
He took a mans life that only wanted to steal from him, and possibly rape his woman, and rough him up.
Poor robber.
Hope you have no intent to protect yer family/belongings by force.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
30,457 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Re: Think it can' happen?

roland45 said:
It is odd though that the Orig poster of this thread,Bcoz, did not say what the out come of the trial was, I mean, his supposedly happend in 1999 right?
From the original post
On August 22, 1999, Tony Martin of Emneth, Norfolk, England, killed one
burglar and wounded a second.

In April, 2000, he was convicted and is now serving a life term in
prison.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,497 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

From your original post:

"In the darkness, you make out two shadows. One holds something that
looks like a crowbar. When the intruder brandishes it as if to strike,you raise the shotgun and fire. The blast knocks both thugs to the
floor".

Like I said.... he should have racked another round and finished what he started! Put yourself in his shoes.... what would have you done? God willing I hope no one that is reading thread has to go through this or defend themselves.... but if so, I'd rather be tried by 12 then any of my family or I carried by 6.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
675 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

Put yourself in his shoes...

Ok, lets do this for a minuet, put ourselves in his shoes.

He has a gun,he knows it is against the law to have a gun, and he uses the gun to stop a threat. Does he belong in prison? of course he does.
Just for having an illegal firearm, he deserves jail time.

Ask all the forum members that voted no in the
" Should convicted felons be permitted to own,shoot and hunt with a muzzleloader?" topic and poll posted on Tue Aug 04 2009 10:58 PM by 10der222. 61 % voted no.

Now lets look at the same type of situation here in the states shall we,
An 18 year old citizen of PA sells a small amount of weed to a under cover officer. They are charged, arrested, pleads guilty, and does time in jail. A few years later, they settle down, finds some one, starts a family, buys a home.
Years pass with out incident, and one day they neighbor down the street gets robbed, a few days later a few more get robbed, but this time the neighbor's wife, or kid got hurt.
So, Our citizen, says the heck with that,and picks up an old sxs percussion shotgun at a gun show, or auction, or online and keeps it loaded and hidden just in case.

Then, Bingo, one night they hear somthing crash down stairs, our citizen grabs the shotgun, goes to investigate, and feeling that his family is in danger, he shoots one of the 2 intruders dead, the other runs off wounded. Our citizen checks the family, they are ok, but shook up.
Our citizen then runs across the street to mothers house, and hides the gun and the family, then our citizen decides they need to get a drink at the local bar to settles some nerves. the police show up a few hours later, because the robber that got away is bleeding on some ones porch a few blocks away. The police investigate, and charge our citizen with murder, our citizen is found guilty by a jury of their peers, and sentenced to death, because they used an illegally gotten gun to commit murder, and they had a drug charge from the past, and they happen to be black or hispanic from Philly, Pburg, or Allentown.
But in PA, its really life in prison, because our governor refuses to sign the warrant.

Does any of this sound familiar?

I would hazzard a guess that this kind of incident happends here in the states, more than anywhere else in the world.

So where is the outrage for OUR citizen that has been treated like this?
No where, because our citizen was a drug dealing,gun law breaking, murderer, unlike the upsatanding English gent that was only protecting his farm house in Emneth.

Give me a break.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,497 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

First and formost.... it is leagal to own a shotgun or rifle in England! It must be registered! And NO automatics! Was he a convict? Don't think so? If he wasn't that this is all a horrible sign of poor justice!

Secondly, since the gentleman that dropped the hammer on the two criminals in his house made a mistake! He let one live! YES... HUGE MISTAKE!!!

But according to you and English law, you would have these scum bags knock you out, rape your wife while your children watch! Possible killing your children! But before you come too and get your wits about youself, you notice that they are still in your house!!! You grap your shotgun and dump'em? Or do you run? I'm going to let them play with hot lead! What happen to self defense?

So, what would you do???? or what should be done in this situation???

"So where is the outrage for OUR citizen that has been treated like this?
No where, because our citizen was a drug dealing,gun law breaking, murderer, unlike the upsatanding English gent that was only protecting his farm house in Emneth".


We should be outragged by this!! Is god given right to protect ourselves from someone trying to harm our families!

I think we are on the same side of the fence on this..... but for some reasone we are not seeing eye to eye!!

I hope and pray that neither one of us would ever have to live through this!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,828 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

ToothHunter said:
First and formost.... it is leagal to own a shotgun or rifle in England! It must be registered! And NO automatics!
....one had to turn in ALL THEIR FIREARMS...they were destroyed....in front of ALL to SEE.....then if one PROVES they need a firearm......if lucky...will be permitted to own one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
675 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

Sgt,
Yes we are on the same side of the fence, but our side of the fence has a bill of rights, and a constitution protecting our rights from tyrants.
This man lives in a country where no bill of rights or constitution exists.
If the man wanted to keep a gun for protection, he should have moved to a location where it is legal to do so. Much like I did 25 years ago when the communist state of NJ started in with gun bans. Give or sell away my AK47?, or M1 carbine? or my SKS? or Ruger 10-22? Not likely, so I packed up my gear,wife and kid, and moved to Penntucky where Free men owning such guns did not make them criminals.
You are right, we should all be outraged over this kind of thing, and I am, a little, because it happend over there.
But, I am more outraged when this kind of thing happends here in the USA, where we have a bill of rights, and a constitution and all the protections therein.
So until the subjects of the United Kingdom either rise up and over throw or, have an English Bastile Day, I just do not have sympathy for them.
The day the Subjects decide to do this, I will send hardware,ammo, money, ect, to help support the cause as I and 10s of thousand others did for the IRA.
I would offer the same support to the subjects of NJ, Mass,
Ill,and Kalifornia, If and when they ever wake up.

Roland
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,145 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

Nuremberg

"Just Following Orders" is not unacceptable excuse.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,099 Posts
Re: Think it can' happen?

THE MAN BROKE THE LAW REGARDLESS OF WHAT WAS TRANSPIRING. I DO HOWEVER FEEL FOR HIM, DO I THINK IT'S RIGHT NO...BUT THAT'S THE WAY IT IS UNTIL THEY, THE PEOPLE OVER TURN THE LAW. LAST YEAR MY HOUSE HAD THE BASEMENT DOOR KICKED IN WHILE EATING DINNER, I COULD NOT GET TO MY WEAPON FAST ENOUGH TO CATCH THEM IN THE BASEMENT. I WOULD HAVE MADE SURE TO KILL THEM BOTH, NO PROBLEM. MY HOME. WHEN THE POLICE CAME TO THE HOUSE THEY EXAMINED MY HANDGUN, THEN INFORMED ME TO SHOOT TO KILL IF ANYONE EVER BROKE INTO MY HOUSE AGAIN. THEY INFORMED ME THAT IT WAS LESS PAPER WORK FOR THEM TO DO. I WOULD LOSE MY HANDGUN UNTIL THE INVESTAGATION WAS OVER AND THEN I COULD APPLY TO THE COURT'S TO GET IT BACK. I WILL PROTECT MY HOME, FAMILY, AND FRIEND'S REGARDLESS OF WHAT THEY DO TO ME.I HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO SO, WHICH UNFORTUNATLY THE OTHER MAN DID NOT BECAUSE OF WHERE HE LIVES.
 
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
Top