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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just in case you didn't know. . . When the bill of rights what created, the second amendment was NOT for hunting, sporting, target shooting, 'snakes and such", etc. It was put in to for citizens to be armed against a tyrannical Federal Government. When dumbo comes out and says "we have no quarrel with hunters"....that's not what it was about. What the progressives are about to try is disarming the people. This is about so there is no "quarrel" when the gov't tries to steal more money from the people and they can't do anything about it.

And another tax increase, and yet another, and we still have high unemployment, and high number of people on the doll, and borrowing 40cents on the dollar to pay for "free" programs the country cannot pay for....and yet more gov't employees making sure YOU pay your fair share. This is Communism. The second amendment is all we have left. The first? ReallY? if you say some bad stuff about the gov't or dumbo, don't you think you are on the watch list? There is not the first amendment anymore. You can't say what you want before you are a racist, or worse, you aren't "with the program".

I don't want to sound like the "alarmist, bitter clinger", but that is where we are. This isn't about the NRA sending you a letter saying "we need your help.." but we are at there...

What country do you want to live in? There isn't some place else to move to where things are better. Even going across state lines things will be better. When Washington imposes it's will, it's nation wide.

It's now or never. We can be serfs or we can be citizens.
The tipping point has been reached, now that we have 4 more years of "survival". We won't survive as a country, but we can at least remain armed. Write your reps and oppose any new gun laws. That's what the Commie's want, and that's what we have left.

God bless the Constitution.
 

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wyomingcounty said:
...I don't want to sound like the "alarmist, bitter clinger",
I do! As a matter of fact, I want every gun owner in the United States to sound exactly like that to the point where bobo hussein Ojugears and every other politician in the country gets so paranoid that they think they're gonna have to wear body armor just to get up in the middle of the night to empty their bladder if they even think about changing our Second Amendment! After all, that's the whole purpose of having the Right To Bear Arms.
 

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I wish thhis was just an alarmist post but in my humble opinion it is right on the money. If our guns go you can bet big brother will stomp all those with open minds into the dirt. The liberal leaders want an autobot society where we feed off government and will work for a pat on the head from those in power.
 

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It's getting ugly. I'm keeping my guns no matter what any politician says. Write your Representatives. Join the NRA.
 

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Absolutely right. The 2nd Amendment was meant to give citizens the means to protect themselves from enemies both foreign and domestic, ie. an opressive government. There are countries that the left lauds ans examples that do not allow parents to name their children with a name that isn't on an approved list. I don't know about you, but I sure don't want that kind of government.
 

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A letter describing why the 2nd amendment is not about hunting and sport shooting.

When I carry a gun….



As the Supreme Court heard arguments for and against the Chicago, IL Gun Ban, this man offered you another stellar example of a letter (written by a Marine), that places the proper perspective on what a gun means to a civilized society. Interesting take and one you don't hear much. Read this eloquent and profound letter and pay close attention to the last paragraph of the letter...



Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force. If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or force me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that's it. In a truly moral and civilized society, people exclusively interact through persuasion. Force has no place as a valid method of social interaction and the only thing that removes force from the menu is the personal firearm, as paradoxical as it may sound to some.



When I carry a gun, you cannot deal with me by force. You have to use reason and try to persuade me, because I have a way to negate your threat or employment of force. The gun is the only personal weapon that puts a 100-pound woman on equal footing with a 220-pound mugger, a 75-year old retiree on equal footing with a 19-year old gang banger, and a single guy on equal footing with a carload of drunken guys with baseball bats. The gun removes the disparity in physical strength, size or numbers between a potential attacker and a defender.



There are plenty of people who consider the gun as the source of bad force equations. These are the people who think that we'd be more civilized if all guns were removed from society, because a firearm makes it easier for a [armed] mugger to do his job. That, of course, is only true if the mugger's potential victims are mostly disarmed either by choice or by legislative fiat -- it has no validity when most of a mugger's potential marks are armed. People who argue for the banning of arms ask for automatic rule by the young, the strong and the many, and that's the exact opposite of a civilized society. A mugger, even an armed one, can only make a successful living in a society where the state has granted him a force monopoly.



Then there's the argument that the gun makes confrontations lethal that otherwise would only result in injury. This argument is fallacious in several ways. Without guns involved, confrontations are won by the physically superior party inflicting overwhelming injury on the loser.



People who think that fists, bats, sticks, or stones don't constitute lethal force, watch too much TV, where people take beatings and come out of it with a bloody lip at worst. The fact that the gun makes lethal force easier works solely in favor of the weaker defender, not the stronger attacker. If both are armed, the field is level. The gun is the only weapon that's as lethal in the hands of an octogenarian as it is in the hands of a weight lifter. It simply wouldn't work as well as a force equalizer if it weren't both lethal and easily employable.



When I carry a gun, I don't do so because I am looking for a fight, but because I'm looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don't carry it because I'm afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force. It removes force from the equation... And that's why carrying a gun is a civilized act.



So, the greatest civilization is one where all citizens are equally armed and can only be persuaded, never forced.



By Maj. L. Caudill, USMC (Ret.)
 

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It's go time boys. It's going to be either use them or lose them within the next year. What's it gonna be? You got it right we have them to defend ourselves against the Gov't. Are we gonna use them though? If we just turn them in we squander all the Founders set out to do.
 

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very well put wyomingcounty. I sure hope more people wake up and smell the coffee. I sometimes wonder...are we the people that believe in the constituition and capitalism now the minority, it sure does seem that way? I am pretty sick and tired of the slugs living of the gov. system. Its getting out of control
 

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As of now I see no advantage in saying we must be prepared to forcibly defend our guns. However I am not going to hand mine over willingly. We are on a dangerous path but still peaceful ways to change it. Our biggest fear should be in appointees to Supreme Court.
 

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300winmagfan said:
If we allow it the US will be Europe before Obama leaves office. How much do we allow?
As someone who holds a German hunting license and weapons registration card for 7 years now, as well as deal with the German firearms regs on a regular basis, I can say that the above prediction is very likely to occur.....if we let it.

From what I've heard, read, or experienced with some states, like MD, CA, NY, they aren't that far away from what the laws are here.

It's also my feeling that the Fed may very well be looking in this direction for guidance on how to frame our laws in the US. Pretty scary, if you ask me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
The language in the bill of rights was put in SPECIFICALLY by some of the framers that were not happy with the constitution alone because they knew it was not enough alone. If you read history, or if you listen to some radio shows like Mike Church, you already know this. The second amendment was put in to prevent the gov't gaining too much control and citizens could do nothing about it. We ARE AT the point where the gov't has gained too much control and now they are trying to disarm the citizens so they will be impotent. Like the UN, "writing letters to tell them how angry we are" will do nothing if we are disarmed people.

We are loosing our rights hand over fist, and if we loose the second, all the rest of the rights we have will fall almost immediately. Why do you think the Marxists currently in the gov't are all too eager to use a school shooting as a springboard to disarm the people? They want total control.

I know this is a hunting site, but this is a larger issue. The vast majority of us gun owners are law abiding citizens, weather we have 1 gun or 100, weather we have muzzle loaders or AK47's. Almost all of the recent hi profile shootings were don't by people who had guns illegally. A very small number of folks go bonkers and commit crimes with guns that make the news. There is something to be said to prevent guns falling in the hands of criminals, or those not of sound mind (it's already a crime, and existing laws making it illegal) The latter seems to be those that commit terrible crimes. That must be stopped and there are things that can be done to prevent it. Gun bans are just an excuse. We all know that criminals don't follow laws. Mental cases slip through the cracks and more gun laws won't stop that. The left wanting to ban this, and ban that is not about keeping folks safe. It's just an excuse to disarm the electorate. It's much like how the "affordable care act" was passed under the guise that it's about health care. It is not about health care. It's about more gov't control. How's your health care premiums? Cheap now, right? Did you get your fine yet for not buying insurance? You will. Go to a hospital lately? Everything is so much better now, yes? When the gov't takes over something, it's never improved.

The school shooting was just a "golden goose" for the Obama regime to have enough "excuses" to propose yet more gun laws to "prevent such heinous crimes". It's a disgrace that politicians use a terrible event to sell us a bill of goods, but that's what they are going to try to do.

I said to a friend today at the gun show, "this might not turn out the way they planned...."

He said, "you're exactly right..."

This is an unsustainable path for the country, and disarming the people will only accelerate that.
 

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he doesn't care about gun crimes- it just works into his agenda to unarm the populous--so he can be dictater--I knew when obama was running the first term that we wouldn't be able to get him out--he is there for life
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I'm afraid he will find some way to serve more than 2 terms. I'm not sure what kind of salute he will want. It won't be the Facist salute, but it will be unique. Our dear leader. Dark days are to come.
 
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