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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok need some help I have a Brittany that's wants to try and flush all the birds when she finds them . As soon as she gets one the scent of a bird she tries to chase them then they flush . I've had her pointing birds before but I also shot birds that she flushed just to get the taste of the after shot .probably a bad idea but now I need to fix the problem I'm trying the check cord and stopping her on quail but she doesn't really like the cord , she just wants to pull any advice on what to do besides the whole still her with check cord ? She is about 1.5 years old
 

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How many birds did you kill in front of her that she didn't point? I think if its a pile of birds, you have created a problem that's tough to handle because she has gotten used to flush and shot and chase and thinks that is way cool. I think there is a fine line between shooting a few non-pointed birds to increase prey drive and shooting too many and they think that's what they are supposed to do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Not many prob 4 missed a lot though I was trying to get her over being gun shy and now that she is over that gotta start working with her on this problem. I got a table to work with her so I can teac her to stop with a bird in a harness any other tricks
 

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Is she whoa trained? If so, I'd put some quail or chukar in a toe tip up is some thick brush and let her work it from the downwind side. As soon as she hits scent and locks up I'd give her a firm no. If she breaks point and tried to paw out the bird I'd move her back to where she originally locked up and steady her and then flush the bird and fire a shot in the air (starter pistol if you have one). Pigeons are the best, because a dog can never catch them. I'd not shoot at any more birds that she doesn't point. PS. From what I've heard at that age, is they can go back to pure puppy mode for a while and only want to bust and chase. Folks call it the terrible two's.
 

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Went through that myself with my 3.5 yr old setter ..Frustrating.. Best advice I have is to get her on more birds. Eventually she did what her breed was made to do.. Birds, birds, birds..
 

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Sounds like you've made a couple mistakes with this pup and really don't know what your doing.
My advice would be to locate a professional trainer in your area and turn the pup over to them for some training. Maybe you can arrange to observe and take part in the training as well, that way you'll both get some training. Don't mean to be blunt but owning a hunting dog doesn't make a person a dog trainer. The money you spend getting a good start for this dog will be well spent if you enjoy bird hunting.
 

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wingshot said:
Sounds like you've made a couple mistakes with this pup and really don't know what your doing.
My advice would be to locate a professional trainer in your area and turn the pup over to them for some training. Maybe you can arrange to observe and take part in the training as well, that way you'll both get some training. Don't mean to be blunt but owning a hunting dog doesn't make a person a dog trainer. The money you spend getting a good start for this dog will be well spent if you enjoy bird hunting.
Never hurts to go to a pro. Just make sure you do the homework on the pro and get some references. I've heard first hand about some pro's using a one size fits all approach and that doesn't always work. Some dogs just can't take heavy pressure while others need a 2x4. Make sure the pro you choose can handle both situations.
 

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Are the birds running? My dog will point birds that set. If they run, she chases. Roosters are especially tough. Most times I try to follow her. If she gets too far ahead, I command her to whoa until I catch up. Yea, sometimes she busts the birds, but they were running anyway. Not a classic pointer but she gets me more birds than she loses.
 

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Pheasants are SOB's. If one only shot perfectly pointed pheasants one wouldn't have too many in the game bag. However, big difference between shooting a bird that your dog originally pointed and then bolted and flushed, then a bird that was put up by a pointer acting like a flusher. I long for the days of quail and less paranoid grouse.
 

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As some of the posters above said, get your dog to a professional trainer. If you are looking for help from strangers on a hunting forum then you obviously are grasping at straws when it comes to answers and resolutions. Not trying to be disrespectful, but for the money I paid for my pup the last thing I was going to do was ruin him by trying to train him myself. Best decision I ever made was listening to my wife when she said, spend the $$$ to send him to a professional trainer. The only thing I did with mine was bird introduction.
 

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im going to give you an alternative option.. and its not a very popular one.

I have a very good 3.5 year old lab with a great nose in what i consider his prime.. I also have a 8 month old weimaraner. We've done some wing on a string training, as well as some woah commands and the basic OB.. shes being collar conditioned with a beeper while we work..

Shes been trailing my lab and she has yet to flush a bird but were getting there.. shes gone on point 3 times at random things and was rock solid until i told her to move (which was wierd because i didnt expect her to lock up)

some are worried she will take the traits of my lab and flush... and to be completely honest if she does, i wont be heartbroken..

I had my lab trained professionally but the Weim is a house dog first, gun dog second..

the single biggest piece of advice i can offer is consider what you want out of your dog.

If you dont have a ton of time to train it correctly, property and be able to correct when mistakes are being made, then your expectations should be real.

If you have the funds to send your dog away that will alleviate alot of the problems you are having (presumably)

its all about managing expectations.. im under the expectations that im not taking my weim to a pro, and if i can get her to tag along and have a great time and maybe point a bird here and there great.. But i dont share the same thoughts and opinions of great bird dog trainers/hunters

good luck..
 

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Well, at $600 or more per month for a pro trainer you might not have the ability to have a pro train your dog. In that case it's good to know that training really isn't that difficult but it does absolutely require commitment and patience. If you can give 15 minutes to your dog each weekday or every other weekday and maybe an hour or two on a weekend then you can train your dog to be a reliable hunting companion. There are several excellent step by step training methods available in book & DVD platform. Two excellent choices are HuntSmith and Perfect Start, Perfect Finish. Another avenue is to join a NAVHDA chapter and attend monthly group trainings to learn how to train your dog. In NAVHDA we help each other train our own dogs using proven methods, and we have pros within our ranks too. If you can afford it and don't have the time or patience to do it yourself, a trainer is a great choice. However, there is knowledge you'll gain about your dog and training as well as about you and the relationship and teamwork you'll build together through training that guys that don't train their own dogs simply don't gain.

If you want your dog to hold its points you have to make the choice to stop shooting birds it breaks point on. I wouldn't even shoot wild flushes at least until the dog learns it must hold point in order to be rewarded with a bird in its mouth. Pheasants are sometimes hard birds to expect a dog to be steady on. Keep in mind too that hunting is not training and many dogs, especially young dogs, will likely break more often during hunting than they will in training. For example, I have a 3yr old Drahthaar that finally proved to be completely steady to wing(flush), shot & fall. That is the dog never broke from the time it went on point, through me flushing & shooting the bird and it falling, until I released him with a Fetch command to retrieve the bird. He repeated this scenario usually flawlessly for the last month of summer training. Hunting season starts in October and although he held point beautifully until the first woodcock flushed he broke on the flush. On woodcock I got him back to at least holding point until the shot but on pheasants he breaks more often then not on the flush. That's fine, we're hunting now and not training or testing. However if he doesn't at least hold his point until I walk up to him and get in position then I don't shoot the bird for him.

I would hunt the dog the rest of the season, try to only shoot birds it at least points. Then in the spring I'd try to get with a group or a buddy and use strong flying pigeons.
 

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The most common problem with dogs that aren't properly trained is its owners. It's not the dogs fault. Get serious about training your dog the right way or be happy with a flusher. People ask me all the time how to fix there dog, I tell them they need to fix themselves first. If you keep rewarding the dog it going to keep flushing. You created a bigger problem thats harder to fix.

Take a step back. Put the gun away and read a book or watch a video on training (I recommend Perfect Start). Get pigeons or whatever, check cord, launcher and cap gun and start over. If you have the patience and follow direction your problem will go away in a few months. Or send it to a pro and hope they know what there doing. Good luck.
 

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aJohnston78,
I can give you the names of a couple pro trainers I've used if you want, just PM me for that info.
Don't be confused by all the well intentioned hot air solutions offered to save a buck.
 

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wingshot said:
aJohnston78,
I can give you the names of a couple pro trainers I've used if you want, just PM me for that info.
Don't be confused by all the well intentioned hot air solutions offered to save a buck.
I'm for sure not trying to get into a [censored] contest over using or not using a pro trainer. A good pro is well worth the money spent but are you trying to say that training a dog yourself via a proven method instead of using a pro is just a hot air solution for the cheap owner?
 

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RyanR said:
wingshot said:
aJohnston78,
I can give you the names of a couple pro trainers I've used if you want, just PM me for that info.
Don't be confused by all the well intentioned hot air solutions offered to save a buck.
I'm for sure not trying to get into a [censored] contest over using or not using a pro trainer. A good pro is well worth the money spent but are you trying to say that training a dog yourself via a proven method instead of using a pro is just a hot air solution for the cheap owner?
RyanR said:
wingshot said:
aJohnston78,
I can give you the names of a couple pro trainers I've used if you want, just PM me for that info.
Don't be confused by all the well intentioned hot air solutions offered to save a buck.
I'm for sure not trying to get into a [censored] contest over using or not using a pro trainer. A good pro is well worth the money spent but are you trying to say that training a dog yourself via a proven method instead of using a pro is just a hot air solution for the cheap owner?
RyanR said:
wingshot said:
aJohnston78,
I can give you the names of a couple pro trainers I've used if you want, just PM me for that info.
Don't be confused by all the well intentioned hot air solutions offered to save a buck.
I'm for sure not trying to get into a [censored] contest over using or not using a pro trainer. A good pro is well worth the money spent but are you trying to say that training a dog yourself via a proven method instead of using a pro is just a hot air solution for the cheap owner?

Nope, that's not what I said at all, not sure how you interpreted it that way. Look, the guy came on here explaining his problem, asking for help and got a lot of ideas from guys who have never seen his dog work. He didn't ask if he should follow any particular training plan.
I recommended he seek the help of a professional because it's often difficult to correct ingrained unwanted behavior in dogs.
Are you suggesting you have the necessary experience and skills to solve his issues? Remember he's not starting out with a new/fresh pup, he's looking for a way to correct problem behavior that he's allowed to become ingrained.
 

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Look, I agree with basically everything you've said on here. It's on the mark. He's got a young dog and yes he's made several mistakes but nothing that can't be fixed with some focused time and consistency. The dog simply isn't pointing and is instead charging in on scent to flush. That's not all that uncommon for a young dog, even at 1.5yrs old. It was suggested he follow a plan to help prevent future training mistakes and give him some consistency in his training IF for whatever reason he chooses to train the dov himself rather than a pro trainer.

Assuming the dog is bred from hunting stock, the dog not pointing after it acknowledges scent is not a hard fix. It takes birds, how many depends on the dog but it takes flying away each and every time the dog charges in after getting scent. Typical way of doing it is using homing pigeons and a few remote launchers or tip-up cages. Put the homers in the launchers spread out in a field. Be ready with the remote and as soon as the dog gets scent launch the bird. Don't say anything to the dog, no commands, just launch the bird. Keep doing this until the dog figures out it needs to point instead of charge in on the scent. Similarly, you can do this in the yard using tip-up cages and the dog on a check cord. It might take just a few birds, it might take a dozen or more.
 

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RyanR,
So you feel that you do have the answers for this fellows problems. You must have a lot of experience training pointing dogs. I've owned nine Brittany's over the last 50 years and I'd take that dog to a professional. Opinions vary I guess.
 

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you know you can do both.
a dog does not have to be sent away to be trained.
how about finding a trainer that works with the dog AND the owner.
 

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wingshot said:
RyanR,
So you feel that you do have the answers for this fellows problems. You must have a lot of experience training pointing dogs. I've owned nine Brittany's over the last 50 years and I'd take that dog to a professional. Opinions vary I guess.
No, I'm not saying I have the answers. It's not about "the answer." It's just training. Train the dog, or take it to a trainer and have them do it for you.

I offered a couple suggestions should he, for whatever reason, decide to train the dog himself. Nothing wrong with either decision, matter of fact he himself could benefit from even spending a day with a trainer, with his dog of course. I try to soak up whatever I can from a pro any chance I get. I just didn't want him to think DIY was very difficult. It isn't but a good step by step plan is needed as the foundation of good training.
 
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