[Trail Cat]

So I went to the public rifle range. there were 3-4 people already there. No more sit down and in rolls the pgc. Said hello and made some short small talk but he just wanted to wait and watch everyone shoot. After standing and watching for about 5 min he pulls the guy aside of me away from the shooting bench and issues a citation because he saw him put 4 rounds in the gun (3 was the max) As soon as he wrote the citation, back in the SUV and away he went. Guess he met his quota for the day.
Granted the guy was breaking a posted rule, but I was shocked he would just give a warning.
I wasn't doing anything wrong but nothing like having someone just standing watching, waiting, and hoping you screw up so they can write a ticket. Wish I had enough land for my on range.....

 

[comblockshooter]

what would you say to the guy next to him who waited for his last shot then started down range. oh sorry it was just another round? be broke the law and a wco was standing right there. oh its the pgc's fault

 

[Woods walker]

How long to you suppose warnings should be given. The 3 shot rule has been in effect for a long time and warning were give for quite a while after the regulation came into effect. There comes a time that when people refuse to follow the rules a citation is used to educate them. For all you know the officer might have warned the same guy in the past and anyone who was there will pass the word that the regulations mean what they say, you just did, they aren't suggestions. People using the range have the opportunity to police themselves, if they refuse someone else will do it. Cheap shot with the quota nonsense, there are no quotas, if you don't like the rules enforced, join a club and use another range where they will kick you out for breaking club rules.

 

[JoeG52]

I have to agree with John. If you don't like the rules then find a different place.

 

[casey]

From what I've heard there is now a ZERO tolerence for rule breakers on PGC ranges.

IMHO it's about time.

 

[mastertracker]

Many shooters have been writing letters and calling Harrisburg or the regional offices complaining about other shooters at the PGC ranges. Enough complaints are filed with supervisors, legislators, etc... the warnings stop and citations start and the littering, scatter firing with lots of rounds stops or at least slows down.

 

[mauser95]

Agree with you there Casey. I hope people realize that use of the SGL ranges are a privilege, not a right. Been talking to the maintenance guys and the sgl 91 range on Suscon rd. is on the short list to close if things keep going downhill. Been some vandalism up there recently (spray painted obcenities) plus too many guys not following the rules, patterning shotguns or playing with buckshot, shooting up the supports, leaving trash around, even a couple of holes put in the roof. We just got this range back last year and if this keeps up we'll be losing it again.

 

[Jbiz]

I have to agree with Trail Cat...

 

[casey]

Food for thought:



In light of recent events and the press surrounding the use of one of our ranges by individuals who were planning a terrorist assault on our troops stationed at Fort Dix, I have decided to write this in hopes of bringing greater attention to our ranges throughout the state.

I and several others have been advocates of a Range Use Permit or fee for users of our ranges that do not possess a hunting or furtaking license. Not only does this make sense from a financial standpoint as thousands of non-license buying users use our ranges throughout the year, but also from a National Security and officer safety standpoint. Had the planned assault on our troops taken place, with apparently all of their live fire training having taken place on one of our ranges, the repercussions would have been far and wide.

Many times over the last few years, officers in the Northeast region have been involved with what appeared to be groups of “concern”. Information was passed to PSP intelligence and gang officers relative to these groups utilizing our ranges.

If individuals were required to have some form of documentation (permit or license), than it would stand to reason that officer and public safety, as well as national security, would be enhanced. It is common knowledge in Law Enforcement that once you have positive ID in hand, individuals are much less likely to assault an officer. I would have to believe that these groups, if they were being documented in some form ( ie. non- transferable permit), would be much less likely to consider such training at our ranges.

 

[Trail Cat]

I guess what is bothersome is that I have seen plenty of people acting stupid in my day that more than deserved to be fined or cited. When people are acting like adults why does it have to go to this extreme.
I'm half paranoid to go back. I have no intention of breaking the rules but if someone hovers over you watching every move, is it even enjoyable.
It's almost like, lets wait for them to screw up and then wham.

 

[R.W.J]

I guess what is bothersome is that I have seen plenty of people acting stupid in my day that more than deserved to be fined or cited. When people are acting like adults why does it have to go to this extreme.
I'm half paranoid to go back. I have no intention of breaking the rules but if someone hovers over you watching every move, is it even enjoyable.
It's almost like, lets wait for them to screw up and then wham.

So just because a WCO is there you would get so nervous you would forget to count to three?

The WCO did his job. I USED to give warnings at my rage, too many complaints of destruction and illegal acts called into Harrisburg, I now have a zero tolerance for violations at the range on SGL 245. The warnings didnt work.

 

[BCozhunter]

Apparently this guy wasn't too bright either. He surely knew a WCO was right there, and still broke the rules

Glad he got the citation. Hopefully he learned that the rules are there for a reason, and if he didn't, hopefully he doesn't come back.

 

[comblockshooter]

thumbs up to rwj. we can't let those that eestroy the range close thew range. why would you expect that certian wco to act any differntly? if they turn their back on this violation where would it stop? 30 round ak mags?

 

[referee]

The range in question has had many problems in the past.

 

[Keystonepaul]

Funny how folks look at things. I'm much more relaxed when the PGC is at the range. Keystonepaul

 

[Birch812]

One of the clubs I shoot at makes you list the time, date and calibers you were going to shoot and were only allowed one shell at a time in rifles.

The rules are for the shooters safety. I don't think the WCO had a quota to make, he observed an infraction and did his job.

 

[customreloading]

Is it any wonder why people dislike the PGC- three bullets or four- zero tolerance. Really. wrong-yes! but is there some level of working with people. We have lost 25% of the hunters in the last 25 years. Few law enforcement criminal issues are zero tolerance, but I guess thats the current state of mind of the PGC.

Hey Keystone are you really more relaxed when a police officer is behind you when you drive, or do you watch your speedometer like everyone does. Your more relaxed???......

 

[bob1961]

just follow the rules and you or anyone else will not have any trouble....how would you like to have to wait for someone who keep's shooting 5, 10, 15 rounds down range when you shot your max 3 and want to go get your target

....you would be pretty upset then, huh..........bob

....

 

[bob1961]

I guess what is bothersome is that I have seen plenty of people acting stupid in my day that more than deserved to be fined or cited. When people are acting like adults why does it have to go to this extreme.
I'm half paranoid to go back. I have no intention of breaking the rules but if someone hovers over you watching every move, is it even enjoyable.
It's almost like, lets wait for them to screw up and then wham.

lmao

very funny, "NOT"....if you are not doing anything wrong why get all nervous and uptight over a WCO watching who ever is at the range..........bob

....

 

[bob1961]

Food for thought:



In light of recent events and the press surrounding the use of one of our ranges by individuals who were planning a terrorist assault on our troops stationed at Fort Dix, I have decided to write this in hopes of bringing greater attention to our ranges throughout the state.

I and several others have been advocates of a Range Use Permit or fee for users of our ranges that do not possess a hunting or furtaking license. Not only does this make sense from a financial standpoint as thousands of non-license buying users use our ranges throughout the year, but also from a National Security and officer safety standpoint. Had the planned assault on our troops taken place, with apparently all of their live fire training having taken place on one of our ranges, the repercussions would have been far and wide.

Many times over the last few years, officers in the Northeast region have been involved with what appeared to be groups of “concern”. Information was passed to PSP intelligence and gang officers relative to these groups utilizing our ranges.

If individuals were required to have some form of documentation (permit or license), than it would stand to reason that officer and public safety, as well as national security, would be enhanced. It is common knowledge in Law Enforcement that once you have positive ID in hand, individuals are much less likely to assault an officer. I would have to believe that these groups, if they were being documented in some form ( ie. non- transferable permit), would be much less likely to consider such training at our ranges.

very good post casey....the range in pike county is full of out of state cars/trucks with handgun shooters....what is the law on out of state handguns brought into PA from N.Y. and N.J....cause i know of people from PA who own handguns can't bring them over there statelines according to them..........bob

....