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I am not a big Pete Rose fan but I think he got a raw deal.
He should go in based on his contributions as a player not what he did in a manager capacity.
A guy like Lawrence Taylor who admitted openly to taking drugs even before a game can get into the hall first time out of the gate, yet Rose did something a whole city bases it's economy on and he gets banned.
I think the Baseball Hall of Fame is more political and holier then thou attitude then the rest of pro sports.
 

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Pete, you signed the deal. Pete you knew you were guilty. Pete you denied it through out your life. Pete you wrote a book about it and decided you did do it after lying about it for decades. Pete you got so many chances to come clean about it but decided to put up with the charade for decades dude. Life time ban shall stand! I hope you never, ever get in.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Last time I checked Lawrence Taylor is not in Cooperstown. Pete agreed to the lifetime ban. He never should have agreed to the ban if he didnt want to live by it. He bet on games, from the dugout! He bet on the Reds while he was manager, from the dugout! He had a guy running his bets, from the dugout! He is a total dirtbag of a human being.

Btw, he was a great baseball player.

Maybe Pete can get into Canton, who knows?
 

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Pete Rose is far from a dirt bag by todays standards. There is no question about that Compared to all of the cheaters of the eighties and nineties. but it is what it is. Its hard to believe that he is seventy five years old though.
 

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surveyor said:
Pete Rose is far from a dirt bag by todays standards. There is no question about that Compared to all of the cheaters of the eighties and nineties. but it is what it is. Its hard to believe that he is seventy five years old though.
The "standards" of baseball players have changed little since the games inception, only how we perceive them. Before Ruth they were considered lazy buffoons unable to get a real job. Alcohol abuse was always prevelent and probably beginning with night games and cross country travel amphetmines were common, and remain common in all sports. Does anyone remember pitchers using butazolidin in the 60's and 70's?. Koufax? I think they shot that drug into race horses so they couldn't feel their feet. Pitchers threw a lot of pitches in those days, numb was good. Codine, cocaine, steroids, oxycontin, vicoden even viagra. Some pitchers handed out amphetimines before games. When Rose was in Philly he was caught in the greenie scandel. There are already guys in the hall who were steroid abusers. Canseco told the truth. Any sport, anytime in history has been dirty. Anything for an edge. Anything to keep you in the game. I can accept the PED's but gambling on the team you are managing?......Owners have always known about PED's and accepted them. (And anyone involved with the game knew too). Gambling while you are a player or manager has always been a no no and could not possibly be overlooked.
Rose is an arrogant liar. I have no pity for him.
Love to watch him play though...just like I enjoyed watching Canseco and Bonds crush the baseball. And Henderson steal bases and mash leadoff homers, Rickey is in those hallowed halls already.
 

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PED's weren't against the rules until recently. By that standard, all of those guys followed the rules of the game at the time they played. Rose didn't. IMO, until Shoeless Joe Jackson gets in, who by most accounts had nothing to do with the throwing of the 1919 Series, Rose has no compelling argument. Jackson currently owns the 3rd highest career average at .356. That is a man who was railroaded by a Commissioner who was more concerned with making a statement than doing the right thing. If Rose was banned for even betting on an Indians/Red Sox game, I could see the argument, but the dude BET ON GAMES HE HAD DIRECT CONTROL OVER. You simply cannot overlook it.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
surveyor said:
Pete Rose is far from a dirt bag by todays standards. There is no question about that Compared to all of the cheaters of the eighties and nineties. but it is what it is. Its hard to believe that he is seventy five years old though.
Tell that to the kids he walked right past and ignored when they asked for an autograph. Pete wanted to be in the Hall for two reasons......

1. Hall of Famers command a higher price for an autograph, speaking engagements, endorsements, etc. than non Hall of Famers.

2. He wanted the prestige the Hall brings.

In that order.

Btw, I didn't want to refer to Pete as a dirtbag but HPA rules forbid what I really wanted to call him.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I liked Rose as a player. They didn't call him Charlie Hustle for nothing. Pete thought he could get a hit every time he was at bat. I liked that way of thinking. I remember, as a kid thinking, who is this guy who runs to first after he gets a walk? Man, that guy is cool. I was 12 at the time.

I just feel when you make your living as a ball player you should give something back. Pete was a taker. That, I didn't like.

Bottom line is.....it was his decision to agree to a lifetime ban from baseball.

MLB owes Pete nothing and neither does the BBHOF.
 

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I guess its only in Baseball where lifetime really means lifetime.

Sure Pete lied, but that had nothing to do with his playing days.
If he fixed games that's a different story but nobody ever accused him of that.
I am sure he agreed to the suspension to make the pressure go away. I know DC will quickly point out this was not MLBB but how many times did Dexter Manley get a lifetime ban from Football for drug abuse???? I can remember it being at least 3 times.

Lets remove all the people from all the Pro sports hall of fame that were drunks, druggies, wife beaters, murderers and thieves.
This will be a lesson to all that on or off the field, before, during and after your carrier is over you are bound to a higher code then the rest of us.
 

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He chose gambling over baseball. Maybe they'll let him in the gambling hall of fame. I don't believe for a minute he didn't try to influence point spreads to win. Why else would he bet on his own games?
 

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He knew the rule. I wouldn't have a problem with a guy betting on his own team merely to win, but it's still against the rules. Mickey Mantle and Willie Mays got kicked out of the HOF for working at a casino well after they retired (which was ridiculous), and Rose wants reinstated after this?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Note: Mantle and Mays' HOF/MLB ban was reversed by MLB Commissioner Peter Ueberroth.

MLB Commissioner Bowie Kuhn issued the ban. He was an idiot.
 

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lynxone said:
I can accept the PED's
WWWHHAAAAT? you're not serious!
As a heart attack. Isn't Tommy John sugery performance enhancing? You could make the argument it is.

I have the pleasure of calling a six time all pro NFL player a friend and he told me point blank how prevelent steriods were and still are in the NFL. When I asked him why he used his answer was, "If you want to keep your job you get on the wagon."

If you think PED's are not being abused at all levels of every sport in the world you believe in Unicorns. At least MLB has almost true random testing. The NFL testing is a joke. Why you think all these players look like WWE superstars?
Baseball writers are now choosing to punish players because of alledged steriod abuse. It's humorous to listen to the clown writers and ex player color telecast specialists act like only a few baseball players used. They all knew what was going on from the beginning. Why is baseball held to a higher standard than the NFL?
No one drinks in the NHL and no one smokes dope in the NBA right? Every single sport has produced bigger better athletes the last 60 years and modern chemestry has had a huge hand in it.

Ego and money. You will never stop it and if you do no one will pay to see, squirts play ball, or skate, or dribble and run. We want to see athletes run like Bolt and swim like Phelps, watch the Williams sisters play tennis. Armstrong on the bike. That is why I "accept it"
Tell me, was it not amazing to watch Bonds turn on just about every inside fastball for three years and hit it a mile? PEDS or not Barry was bad news for MLB pitchers. And yes you can take it to the bank a lot of those pitchers were using too.

I know he's a jerk but Canseco's book was mostly true. That is exactly why MLB has gone out of it's way to shut him up. But as usual in this world we now live in, the truth is too unnerving so we will pretend it was a small percentage of abusers. Just let your mind wander back to the mid seventys to the present and look at your favorite team, every single team in the league had users. I wasn't looking at Dykstra's tobacco stained shirts.. I was trying to figure out why he went from skinny to bursting out of them in one season. The amazing transformation of rail thin Ricky Henderson, and Sosa. Incavilia, Dalton. NFL dudes starting showing up in MLB. As time progressed more and more players were "getting on the wagon"

I suspect Rose was using PEDS late in his playing career as well, Twenty four years in the league and like Bonds improving as he aged beyond what seemed normal. Plus he was caught red handed in the greenie scandal.......amphetimines to dianabol is not a real stretch.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Lynx, you're post was right on the money.


I heard a reporter once say, when The Refridgerator Perry came in the league he was one of four NFL players over 300 hundred pounds. How many are there now?
 

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I'm bettin o line average of 340 and d lines prolly 310? I often think of Jerry Cramer. How would Cramer have handled Reggie White, Bruce Smith? The all pros from Cramers days were great but how would a 250lb guard handled today's beasts?
 
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