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19 years ago, a dairy farmer up stream left his cattle tromp and and down the stream on his property. The manure floated down stream and fouled the stream on our property. Green slime, long weeds, fish all gone or dead, brown scum on the water, water stank, etc. Well the farmer died, the cattle were sold and the stream ran clear again after a year or two. A new dairy farmer bought the farm upstream, but he keeps his cattle out of and away from the stream. The stream water is still crystal clear with none of the objectionable things that once occurred. There were times I wanted to beat the crap out of the prior farmer. And it was just over the stream water, not my well. Had it been my well also, I would have sued also. Having your water turn to a stinking mess, unappetizing and ruining whatever is cooked or washed in it. I would not stand for it.
 

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I was a history major in college.
Civics class in high school taught me that this country was built by the rich and those that took risks.
Therefore the laws were also written by the rich.

The laws in Pennsylvania were written in such a way that it was almost legal to steal the natural resources beneath the land. Up and until 1976, there was not even reclamation laws in Pennsylvania that forced coal barons to reclaim land damaged by coal strip mining.

Our country is desperate for natural gas and oil.
Unfortunately the oil we produce is mostly shipped over sea's, not used domestically.

If you look at what they had to pay vs. how much profit those wells will produce, it is a minuscule amount.

And, with eminent domain, the state can take your property - for the good of the commonwealth, and there isn't a darned thing you can do about it!

I live in an abandoned coal mining town.
That town was built by the coal barons from New York - Iselin's. Everything from Ryker's Island to Ryker's Yard was all owned by The BR&P coal, iron and coke company.
Towns were named for family members, water supplies were damaged by coal mining,strip mining, natural gas production, later fracking, etc.

You can whine, scream, moan all you want, very rarely will the government do anything large scale about it.
Our grandchildren will still be paying for what our parents did 40 years ago. And yet, the water quality in most rural areas is still 100% better than it was just 10 years ago.

It is a slow process, it will take time, there will be a lot more mistakes made before someone comes along and makes laws protecting our environment. Those laws will cost you money, at the gas pump, your utility providers, and in the grocery store.

Using data provided by the government, there is almost 30% of the children in Pennsylvania that worries if there will be enough food in their house over the weekend, that they can eat. Most of those children, their main meal comes from the free lunch provided by the government / school district. Now we have take home bags for them to eat over the weekend and free breakfasts in the school before class.

Every time they raise the price of gasoline, natural gas, home heating oil, food - it is the children that suffers the most! How far would you like to push ecology?
Do you want cheap fuel or do you want a clean environment?
 

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That is what the problem is with the people living in Erie.

They want it all, but they don't want to pay for it.

They expect everyone else to pay for a clean, healthy environment, and then they wonder why no one wants to relocate to Erie or build new industry when the old industry that built Erie was chased out.

Koehler Beer - was charged millions of dollars for sewage they never used.
The city council was so inept they did not realize that the water used by Koehler Beer was put into the bottles, not put down the drain.

GAF, The steel mills, the coke industry - all gone. Why, because no one wanted the pollution that went along with growth and prosperity.

Just a couple of examples - how bureaucracy works.
 

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I dont mind paying afair share but do not enjoy being raked over the coals.

when gas was close to 4.00 a gallon exxon made something like 400 billion PROFIT in one quarter.

if gas was 2.00 a gallon wouldnt they have made something like 200 billion in PROFIT ?

with that much in PROFIT they can afford to do it right and do it cleaner.
 

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bohunr said:
I dont mind paying afair share but do not enjoy being raked over the coals.

when gas was close to 4.00 a gallon exxon made something like 400 billion PROFIT in one quarter.

if gas was 2.00 a gallon wouldnt they have made something like 200 billion in PROFIT ?

with that much in PROFIT they can afford to do it right and do it cleaner.

Producing gasoline is not on a linear scale.
The price of gasoline is dependent upon the exchange rate of the US Dollar.
The Oil Sheiks do not care how much the oil companies charges the US People for fuel.
Note I did not say US Oil Companies - because almost no foreign oil companies are located in the USA, although they might have offices here.

As an example, I am an amateur radio operator. 6 years ago I purchased a simple Yaesu mobile FM transceiver $475.00
5 years later, when the dollar was worth more on the foreign market, now that very same transceiver sells for $350.00!
I lost $125.00 by buying it 6 years ago.

The value of the dollar is manipulated by the US government. Our situation was that we owed money to China that we could not afford to pay back. So our government deflated the value of our dollar so China would have only gotten about 50 cents on the dollar. China refused to take our money and loaned our country even more money to bail it out so it would not fail.
Only dumb people would believe that this house of cards could stand.
In 2009 we almost lost the whole shooting match. It was to within a couple of days of our country shutting down the banking industry - the same as 1929 and The Great Depression.
I had friends in Charlotte NC that were making good money one week, collecting unemployment - and lost their house the next!
1/3 of all the credit card companies and the banking industry was located in a circle of about 90 miles from Charlotte NC.
Even NASCAR teams lost about 50% of their sponsorship, closed their doors, or laid off a majority of their staff.
The good times were over!

I also knew guys that went to Alaska in the 70's and worked on the Alaska pipeline.
The oil companies promised us that after it was built, our country would be flooded with oil and they would be giving it away.
And yet none of the crude produced in Alaska has made it's way into the continental USA.
It is mostly shipped to Japan and other countries that are willing to pay more money for it!
Nothing is as simple as our country makes it out to be. Most everything the public is told is lies and cover up's!
 

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When Beaver Valley Nuclear Power Generation Station, Susquehana, Three Mile Island Nuclear Generating stations were built, the electric companies told their customers that electric would become so cheap that eventually they would even remove the electric meters from the homes and would just charge the customers a flat rate for the electric they produced.

Where did all of that FREE Electric go to?

In fact, none of those power plants were even designed to produce electric. I bet none of you people even knew that!
Those power plants were designed to produce weapons grade Plutonium from Uranium. And, they did it right in front of the Russians noses.

Why do you think we fight with North Korea?
Because we do not want them to develop the same technology that we take for granted..
If they were allowed to build nuclear power plants, it would only be a matter of months before they would have enough Plutonium to fuel a dozen rockets.

So what does my family do? Well, I have a brother that works for Siemens that goes into the power plants and retrofits those steam turbines so they produce more power.
I have another that rebuilds the sub-stations.
I worked for Siemens Automation.

Believe me, I know what I am talking about!

Refineries are a lot like steel mills.
They run at two speeds, balls to the wall - all out, or idle, nothing in between...
Everything is operated to the breaking point, and then it is a mad scramble to repair it as fast and as cheap as possible. What ever it costs, it directly translated to the price you pay at the pumps! The refineries and the oil companies never looses any money!
What ever fines you impose on them is put into the price for the fuel you purchase.

Just like Penn State University and the Jerry Sandusky / Joe Paterno scandal. The students and the fans that attends the football games pays what ever fines you make the school pay for their indiscretions. They just raise the price of the ticket and the tuition and the stupid people pays it - because they are getting what they want!
 
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