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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know you can hunt from a horse, but can you have a horse and wagon on SGL? Yesterday, and the last 2 years, I witnessed the amish using a horse and wagon to haul people around while driving, and also when one of them would shoot a deer they would drag it to the road and mark the spot with orange ribbon then the guy driving the wagon would come along and pick up the deer. If this is legal I may just give up hunting and invest in a few horses and wagons and for a fee take hunters as far back in the woods as they want to go. I walk 2 1/2 miles from the parking lot to get away from this crap and the amish come along in their wagon with about 50 guys and shoot anything that moves. If they had to walk they probably wouldn't hunt this area because it would be a 5+ mile walk for them, then they would have to drag the deer back.
 

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If its back one of the gated roads the PGC opens to allow access by vehicle then yes its legal I don't see why not. But if they are just riding around through the SGL and not on a designated horse trail I would say its no different then motoring around on a ATV and not allowable
 

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i believe it is leagal due to their 'special treatment'given to them on various laws--they walk to a different drummer and alot of laws accomodate their ways but we have to obide.the majority of them are very nice people though.
 

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vapor trail said:
i believe it is leagal due to their 'special treatment'given to them on various laws--they walk to a different drummer and alot of laws accomodate their ways but we have to obide.the majority of them are very nice people though.
If this is true that is crap. Laws are laws and no matter what religion, race, or sex you should have to abide by the laws
 

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My understanding, is that if the road is opened for vehicle traffic a wagon would be allowed, however, if not open, thhen wheeled vehicles are not permitted except for handicapped. I remember reading the regs with a fellow who made a mention about a horse drawn sleigh apparently being ok, but the wagon with wheels was not, go figure.

Ok apparently I was thinking of a draft reg from a couple of years ago, here is the current reg:
135.41. State game lands.
(a) Restrictions limited. The following exceptions to § 135.2 (relating to unlawful actions) pertain to lands and waters designated as State game lands:




(c) Additional prohibitions. In addition to the prohibitions contained in the act pertaining to State game lands and § 135.2, except with the written permission of the Director, it is unlawful to:


(4) Ride a nonmotorized vehicle, conveyance or animal, except on roads normally open to public travel, or designated routes as posted, or while lawfully engaged in hunting, trapping or fishing.
(5) Ride a nonmotorized vehicle, conveyance or animal from the last Saturday in September until the third Saturday in January, and before 1 p.m. from the second Saturday in April through the last Saturday in May inclusive, except on Sundays or while lawfully engaged in hunting, trapping or fishing.

6) Ride a nonmotorized vehicle, conveyance or animal on roads open to foot travel only.





(21) Except on Sundays, be present on State game lands from November 15 through December 15 inclusive when not engaged in lawful hunting or trapping and fail to wear a minimum of 250 square inches of daylight fluorescent orange-colored material on the head, chest and back combined or, in lieu thereof, a hat of the same colored material. The material shall be worn so it is visible in a 360° arc. Persons using shooting ranges are exempted from this requirement.

So the wagon driver would be required to have the orange.
 

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7mm08, as long as I can remember, folks used bicycles back at 211 to get further back into the game lands. Apparently that is still ok. A horse drawn wagon seems to be ok so long as engaged in hunting. Now what constitutes engaged in hunting is another complex quesstion. Remember that old western "War Wagon" I can see the Amish riding down the road doing driveby shootings on deer in the food plots. Kind of like the folks shooting Buffalo from trains back in the 1870's. Was this one of the storm front carriages with heat in it. I can imagine, those guys hauling a chuck wagon back in to serve lunch too.
 

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It doesn't matter if open to public travel subpart(4), I think t would be legal under subpart(5). Now whether the driver is hunting is another story. Putting on the requisite orange annd having the orange would seem to be sufficient. Now if the drivier is hunting, whether hunting includes assisting hunters, etc is more complex than the reg discloses.
 

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My question is this, most SGL roads are gated and locked, 211 probably is one of them. HOW did the Amish get a wagon around the gate? And if they did, in my mind, it would be a violation, correct? A horse would be ok, but the wagon?
 

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Dutch said:
My question is this, most SGL roads are gated and locked, 211 probably is one of them. HOW did the Amish get a wagon around the gate? And if they did, in my mind, it would be a violation, correct? A horse would be ok, but the wagon?
PSSST, Dutch...PSSTT...


Read this...

http://www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/lib/pgc/digestpdfs/2009/page20.pdf

Read the 24th line down...pay attention to WORDS and the meaning of them!

You will get your answer!
 

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since they were hunting i have no problem with it as long as rosters are filled out. no different than riding a bike back a trail. from what i read in book they are O.K. legally. for your new business i suggest targeting duck hunters at ontelaunee, longer seasons=more cash i'll sign up
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I can't believe that a roster was filled out. From where I was I could see 7 drivers and I could only see about 75 yards each way. At that rate they would need 15-20 drivers, so they would have had over 25 guys. Last year I was watching a spike buck 10 minutes before their drive came through and about 5 minutes before they got to where I was I heard shooting. I'm sure they shot that buck, but there wasn't a junior hunter in sight when they came past me. And I never said this was on SGL 211.
 
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So what's stopping anyone else from getting a horse and carriage and doing the same thing the amish are. I can't figure out if you people are ticked off the amish out smarted you or someone shot your deer.
 

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Only thing I was mad about was the comment how someone said they were prob allowed due to special treatment. I had amish people do work on my house and they were perfect standup people. They wanted no special treatment and actually complained about the family that will not add a septic system at their school
 

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Amish are like everyone else. There are good and bad. Some of them are real nice folks.

I would say it is illegal unless it is an area designated for horse-riding or it is an area where a motor-vehicle is permitted.

Excerpted this from a link in Woodywooducks post (key in on what I put in bold):

"......the following activities are prohibited:

• Camp or use campsites.
• Contaminate, pollute or degrade groundwaters or surface waters
or any waterways.
• Graze or permit the grazing of domestic livestock; place or
maintain beehives or beekeeping apparatus.
• Solicit or place private advertisements, signs or posters.
• Plant, gather, cut, dig, remove or otherwise injure any plants or
parts thereof, including trees, shrubs, vines, flowering plants and
cultivated crops. (Mushrooms and fruits of berry-producing
plants may be picked.)
• Travel on lands by means of any vehicle or conveyance propelled
by motorized power. (Exemption for individuals with Disabled
Person Permit for battery-powered motorized wheelchair.)
• Ride a non-motorized vehicle, conveyance or animal, except on
roads normally open to public travel, or designated routes as
posted, or while lawfully engaged in hunting, trapping or fishing.
• Ride a non-motorized vehicle, conveyance or animal from the last
Saturday in September until the third Saturday in January, and
prior to one hour after close of lawful shooting hours for spring
turkey season from the second Saturday in April through the last
Saturday in May, inclusive, except on Sundays or while lawfully
engaged in hunting, trapping or fishing.
• Ride a non-motorized vehicle, conveyance or animal on roads open to foot travel only.

• Drive motor vehicles with or without attachments having a
registered gross vehicle weight in excess of 12,000 pounds.
• Use boats propelled by a motor. Battery-powered electric motors
may be used on waterways unless otherwise posted.
• Fish from dam breasts posted against fishing.
• Swim in any dam, pond, lake or stream.
• Injure, destroy or cause damage to property, real, personal or
mixed.
• Remove or attempt to remove any manmade or natural object,
except wildlife and fish lawfully taken. Objects that may not be
removed include animals, rocks, minerals, sand and historical or
archaeological artifacts.
• Participate in, become part of, contribute to or engage in
disorderly conduct.
• Travel on roads open to vehicular travel with vehicle or conveyance
propelled by motorized power that is not licensed or
authorized for operation on a public highway.
• Violate, fail or neglect to follow instructions posted on signs
authorized by the Director.
• Destroy, mutilate or remove any sign or placard.
• Travel by mechanical or motorized conveyance or ride animals on
newly constructed, seeded or planted roads, or other areas, when
posted against travel.

• Consume, possess or transport any alcohol, liquor, beer, malt or
brewed alcoholic beverage.
• Use or possess any controlled substance.
• Occupy, use or construct, place or maintain structures or other
tangible property, except that portable hunting blinds and stands
may be used, provided no damage is caused to trees......"
 
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