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Amen, now comes the real test. Will we use this new found energy at home to make American lives cheaper, more efficient, cleaner and to provide jobs. Or, will the large companies sell overseas, control the supply to manipulate prices and screw the middle class? This is the tipping point and the most important part of the equation. Now that it's cheap, what will they do?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I hope it does alleviate the cost of energy here but a number of changes need to come before it impacts our life in a meaningful way.

U.S. gas closed today at approximately $2.30, approximately $12.00 and $15.00 in Europe and Asia respectively. Hard to keep a profit driven company from ignoring the differences.
 

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Thanks for the fix....guess I should have checked it...


Living in a area where the gas business creates a lot of jobs, in a time when the rest of our economy is is still down, the export is a double edge sword.

The export market creates a demand, hence work is better, more jobs etc..etc.

But then we all want the energy independance and would like to see the NG used at home.

I guess in the end it doesnt matter what we want, the energy companys will do what makes them the most money.
 

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Largest shale play in the world, infrastructure started, lets keep them here drilling and in the meantime IF some NG goes overseas that keeps it profitable while we start finding more uses for NG right here.
 

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1trueamerican said:
Largest shale play in the world, infrastructure started, lets keep them here drilling and in the meantime IF some NG goes overseas that keeps it profitable while we start finding more uses for NG right here.
I agree with that thought, I'v learned in the milk buisness that you can't build a wall around your country.
 

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jj103.5 said:
1trueamerican said:
Largest shale play in the world, infrastructure started, lets keep them here drilling and in the meantime IF some NG goes overseas that keeps it profitable while we start finding more uses for NG right here.
I agree with that thought, I'v learned in the milk buisness that you can't build a wall around your country.
Nobody is stopping the drilling, it might fluctuate between busy and break-neck but it's not going anywhere. Once the LNG deportation sites are on-line on the east coast I fear that it will be a lot like letting the genie out of the bottle. For profit driven companies it's a no brainer. We have a limited amount of time to develop the infrastructure here to create the demand because if we don't the Chinese are buying and buying big.

I'm extremely Nationalistic on the point of energy independence. We need the infrastructure and the GAS here. I have no problem with them keeping it profitable because we need the profit for the jobs. I do have a problem with them selling out to China and Europe so that their CEOs can get 200 million dollar golden parachutes. Creating a domestic market for gas is not building a wall around the resource, it's being smart and finding a balance between creating jobs and providing this country with much needed energy. Stemming the tide of greed is almost an insurmountable obstacle and I have great reseravtions about where all this gas will end up.
 

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One place it <span style="font-style: italic">should</span> "end up", is building some gas-fired generation plants in the northern tier, close to the gas fields. Or, once pipelines have been built, closer to the end users.

One had been proposed sometime ago, but I haven't seen much news on that lately.

Naturally, it would create another mess, because there are already several groups fighting a proposed transmission line across PA, to supply power to NY and NJ. But there are already major efforts being made by several environmental orgs against coal-fired generation plants now.

Gas is available, more efficient, cleaner and probably cheaper in the long run?
 

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Exactly, this is the moment of truth where if this resource is really meant to benefit our country the politicians and corporations will decide to endorse the infrastructure and get things done. And, it won't have a thing to do with the Anti's. The Anti's couldn't stop the vast developmnent of the resource and they can't stop implementation of the infrastructure if the govt and the companies want it to happen.
 

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I would assume that if the "cracker" comes through here in SW PA that drilling will pick up locally. It will not likely influence gas prices and may not increase drilling statewide, but it will likely increase production in the wet gas regions.
 

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LDD - when all that foreign money comes here we will have the capital to invest in whatever we deem best. Now, selling $2.50 gas and buying foreign oil isn't a good exchange.
 

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HomeintheWoods said:
LDD - when all that foreign money comes here we will have the capital to invest in whatever we deem best. Now, selling $2.50 gas and buying foreign oil isn't a good exchange.
I'm really not sure how the 2.50 gas is not beneficial to our own economy and the american consumer? It reduces the profit margin for the large energy companies but last I checked they're still drilling and employing people and homeowners can actually afford to heat their homes freeing up money to spend elsewhere. Saying that foreign investment money will be a boon to the development of our economy is a half truth. It's a necessary part of the equation but the chinese care only about the chinese and these drilling companies care only about their profit margin. Those two factors together could be detrimental to the future of our energy independence.
 

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When foreigners buy our gas that gives us an influx of new capital. When we buy our gas, it's just a shift of existing capital. When we buy our gas instead of buying Saudi oil, that's a preservation of our capital. When we buy our gas, don't buy Saudi oil, and sell gas to China, we are in the best overall capital position.
By no means am I saying that we should deplete a 10 year supply in 3 years by selling it internationally. But what would happen if we woke up tomorrow and all countries said they were unwilling to export their energy supply?
 

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Yeah, I understand what you're saying and that makes a lot of sense and I do believe that we should export some. However, I guess that it's the "we" part that I'm not comfortable with. When you say "we" are in the best overall capital position you mean the energy companies, which can have a benefit for Americans through the trickle down theory...but I'm leery. Especially when control of these companies is bought and sold globally. So, in essence we can have Chinese or Russian interests investing in these resources and funneling the resource out of our country while paying themselves to do it. I understand it's a global economy and yadda yadda yadda but I'm not sold on it. Just because that's the "way things work" doesn't mean it's best for the country.

When I was a kid it would have been unthinkable to do business with the Russians (Soviet Union at that time)... a commmunist country that was openly competing for world power with us. Now, we let their present day equivalent, China, buy up half our country and assume our debt! We're slowly selling the country in the name of the global economy and I'll be ashamed if it happens to this resource in Pennsylvania. We have a chance to help America here, I don't have any interest in lining the corporate pockets of the megarich or cutting deals so that the Chinese can build a war machine against us. I don't believe that selling all this gas is "necessary". Look right now at this state. There are great jobs and cheap gas. What do we want? More...more, more...? If that's what we want then by the time my son is ready to get a job it will have been drilled, piped, tanked and sold. We'll still be dependent on oil and everything will be expensive as [censored]...but we'll have more. That's my two cents on this topic. Sorry man but I get worked over this crap...
 

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LDD said:
Yeah, I understand what you're saying and that makes a lot of sense and I do believe that we should export some. However, I guess that it's the "we" part that I'm not comfortable with. When you say "we" are in the best overall capital position you mean the energy companies, which can have a benefit for Americans through the trickle down theory...but I'm leery. Especially when control of these companies is bought and sold globally. So, in essence we can have Chinese or Russian interests investing in these resources and funneling the resource out of our country while paying themselves to do it. I understand it's a global economy and yadda yadda yadda but I'm not sold on it. Just because that's the "way things work" doesn't mean it's best for the country.

When I was a kid it would have been unthinkable to do business with the Russians (Soviet Union at that time)... a commmunist country that was openly competing for world power with us. Now, we let their present day equivalent, China, buy up half our country and assume our debt! We're slowly selling the country in the name of the global economy and I'll be ashamed if it happens to this resource in Pennsylvania. We have a chance to help America here, I don't have any interest in lining the corporate pockets of the megarich or cutting deals so that the Chinese can build a war machine against us. I don't believe that selling all this gas is "necessary". Look right now at this state. There are great jobs and cheap gas. What do we want? More...more, more...? If that's what we want then by the time my son is ready to get a job it will have been drilled, piped, tanked and sold. We'll still be dependent on oil and everything will be expensive as [censored]...but we'll have more. That's my two cents on this topic. Sorry man but I get worked over this crap...
LDD you have every right to get worked up! This quote in your last post summarizes it nicely!
"china cares about china and the gas companies care aboutthe gas companies"

the biggest defect we human beings have is our shortsightedness...........nuff said!
 

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Last I knew companies were owned by stockholders. Those stockholders are mutual funds, pension funds or individual investors. Those mutual funds and pensions are there to provide for the retirement savings of millions of us. So, companies making money is a bad thing? And oh by the way, if it wasn't for gas company's desire to make money the development of the Marcellus Shale wouldn't have occurred.
 

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Companies making money isn't a bad thing at all...problem occurs when the vast majority of the controlling interest of those stocks is from foreign investment. So, I'm guessing you're all for selling out the shale gas to the highest foreign bidder then? I'm not, difference of opinion, that's all. I'm for developing incentives at home to create the market for the gas and not supporting the communist regime in China no matter how much money they have.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Incentives? How about retroactive Impact Fees? A wonderful incentive pass a bill in 2012 and charge for wells in 2010 and 2011....A great incentive for low priced gas!
 
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