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Discussion Starter #1
In the coming gun debate, we are still in the preemptive mode. The troops are gathering and lines are being formed. Once the new legislative year starts in earnest, we will form the battle lines aand join the discussion as bills are proposed and the detailed debate begins.


The coming battle will be at every level of government; local, state, and federal. In PA the local battles are more a side issue as they can not preempt state law. But those laws still need opposed and challenged in the courts - usually.


Stay tuned, get informed, and be engaged as an individual. This is not the time to allow others to do the heavy lifting. Each of us needs to do the things we can to support the overall effort.


Just as important, understand the issues. Just looking someone in the eye and saying the 2d A allows it or the law allows it won't cut it this time. Besides, we need to win over those not hard anti gun. There are a ton of people out there that run on headlines and are at the mercy of a lack of real information and the buzz lines and words usually backed up with inaccurate information.


As each of us encounter family, friends, co-workers, or others in our daily life and the issue comes up, look at those encounters as a means to educate rather than defend. Calmly taking each claim they present and adding or correcting to the information they offer with real and correct information is very important Offering to find and provide, or telling them where to look for the real information is very important. Also with all the phones out there that access the net - having the information handy is easy and supports our side.

Use it.


In this coming battle, we will need to win over the middle. That means that the in your face confrontational tactics we usually need to use with the everyday left has the strong possibility to turn off a potential supporter once shown factual information.


So:

Stand up for our rights.

Know the current laws we operate under and how they work.

Know where to direct others to see and read the current laws and be able to tell them where it can be found. State and federal sources trump 2nd A sites - we are trying to prove a point. Using our sites will be seen as providing "canned" information.

Be calm and respectful in discussions. Even if the person you are talking to raises the tone - stay calm and respectful - others are watching. Being loud and forceful doesn't sell a point. Real information does.

Know when to walk away. Some people can not and will not change their positions.

ALWAYS assume someone else is listening. At work, while out and about while shopping, at the gas station, or most other places in daily life, someone else is usually in ear shot. They could be as interested in the information or more so than the person you are talking to.

Thus the importance of referring anyone to state or federal government sites to verify the information.


Internet gun sales are being touted as unchecked and unlawful in the news.

Know the law. Interstate gun sales require shipment to a FFL licensee. Then a full normal background check before the person gets the gun they bought on the net. That applies to not only hand guns, but long guns as well - except muzzleloaders.

Gun show law is again another topic being tossed into the fray by the media.

Hand guns require a background check for everyone - private or dealer. Long guns can be sold to state residents without a background check. If you buy or sell to a dealer - paperwork is involved. If you buy from a dealer - the background check is completed. Doesn't matter if the sale happens in a brick and mortar shop or over a folding table at a gun show - state and federal law applies.


In the coming battle look for ammo sales and possession to become an issue.

Look for the use of lead to come into play.

New - look for reloading to become an issue.

Basically, anything that makes ownership easy, economical, or adds to the enjoyment will be under assault this time.


Our side will win or at the least minimize the damage by educating people to the actual functioning laws on the books. Most people do not have a clue what the laws are, they only know what they see on the news as filtered by those opposed to our rights.



Lets use this thread to list the places where everyone can link up the sources that are easy to read and use that make our case.

Again, 2nd A sites should be avoided. Independent regulatory sites and fact sheets should be used. Those sites take the talking points away from both sides. Official governmental sites are non-biased and factual.

The goal is education. Provide the natural sources. They support our side - not the anti side.
 

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Great wisdom in this post.
I would add please understand that because someone disagrees or has another point of view does not make them your personal enemy, an enemy of freedom or less patriotic. It is the vast middle that will make the difference.
 

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Fantastic job Bluetick. Thanks for posting this.
 

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Very well said! More to this point, do what you can even if its something small. For me I have alot of "friends" on Facebook who are now seeing a daily pro-gun message from me. I crush liberals in face to face debates with facts, not hyperbole. Educate yourself and if you haven't already done it join (or rejoin) the NRA and GOA. I've had my issues with the NRA but all that is water under the bridge now, its time for us to unify and not waste our time arguing among ourselves about the lack of deer, crossbows, etc. Like I mention before this incident with the murder of innocent children by a madman is the Pearl Harbor for gun control. Liberals are gonna use this to advance their agendas, and you don't want the world they want. Disarmed citizen being preyed upon by armed criminals.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
The pro gun message needs to be consumer friendly. The in your face needs to be shelved right now. Same facts, same beliefs - different tone.

Once again, the goal is education and gaining support with real facts.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Go for it -


Just put a link back to HPA in the post if allowed.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
The following aticle was posted by PGH Bowhunter15 in another thread.

http://larrycorreia.wordpress.com/2012/12/20/an-opinion-on-gun-control/

Seriously, This single article is a great source of those talking points and statistics that I have been talking about.


Read every word of this LONG article. It is instructive in how to discuss the issues - all of them.


It is long, but the guy does have a sense of humor:


<span style="font-style: italic">So many defensive gun uses never get tracked as such. From personal experience, I have pulled a gun exactly one time in my entire life. I was legally justified and the bad guy stopped, put his gun away, and left. (15 years later the same son of a [censored] would end up murdering a local sheriff’s deputy). My defensive gun use was never recorded anywhere as far as I know. My wife has pulled a gun twice in her life. Once on somebody who was acting very rapey who suddenly found a better place to be when she stuck a Ruger in his face, and again many years later on a German Shepherd which was attacking my one year old son. <span style="font-weight: bold">(amazingly enough a dog can recognize a 9mm coming out of a fanny pack and run for its life, go figure)</span> No police report at all on the second one, and I don’t believe the first one ever turned up as any sort of defensive use statistic, all because no shots were fired</span>
 

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Discussion Starter #12
From the article:

So even if you use the worst number provided by people who are just as biased as me but in the opposite direction, gun use is a huge net positive. <span style="font-weight: bold">Or to put it another way, the Brady Center hates guns so much that they are totally cool with the population of a decent sized city getting raped and murdered every year as collateral damage in order to get what they want</span>


<span style="font-style: italic">Doesn’t matter. I don’t like them. We should ban them and take them all away like a civilized country</span>


Australia had a mass shooting and instituted a massive gun ban and confiscation (a program which would not work here, which I’ll get to, but let’s run with it anyway.). As was pointed out to me on Facebook, they haven’t had any mass shootings since. However, they fail to realize that they didn’t really have any mass shootings before either. .......

And violent crime is up in Australia. A cursory Google search will show articles about the increase in violent crime and theft, but then other articles pooh-pooing these stats as being insignificant and totally not related to the guns.

So then we’ve got England, where they reacted swiftly after a mass shooting, banned and confiscated guns, and their violent crime has since skyrocketed. Their stats are far worse than Australia, and they are now one of the more dangerous countries to live in the EU. Once again, cursory Google search will show articles with the stats, and other articles saying that those rises like totally have nothing to do with regular folks no longer being able to defend themselves… Sensing a trend yet?

And then we’ve got South Africa, which instituted some really hard core gun bans and some extremely strict controls, and their crime is now so high that it is basically either no longer tracked or simply not countable. ......


Then you’ve got countries like Norway, with extremely strict gun control. Their gun control laws are simply incomprehensible to half of Americans. Not only that, they are an ethnically and socially homogenous, tiny population, well off country, without our gang violence or drug problems. Their gun control laws are draconian by our standards. They make Chicago look like Boise. <span style="font-weight: bold">Surely that level of gun control will stop school shootings! Except of course for 2011 when a maniac killed 77 and injured 242 people, a body count which is absurdly high compared to anything which has happened America.</span>


Because once again, repeat it with me, criminals simply do not give a crap.

That mass killer used a gun and homemade explosives. Make guns harder to get, and explosives become the weapon of choice. <span style="font-weight: bold">Please do keep in mind that the largest and most advanced military coalition in human history was basically stymied for a decade by a small group using high school level chemistry and the Afghani equivalent to Radio Shack.</span>


The biggest mass killings in US history have used bombs (like Bath, Michigan), fire (like Happyland Nightclub) or airliners. There is no law you can pass, nothing you can say or do, which will make some not be evil.






Read this Blog entry in it entirity!
 

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Great advice in your post. I also noticed the media already substituted Wayne LaPierre's recommendation of "armed police officers" with thier own rendition of "guards". There is a world of difference between police officers and guards. Some may view this as semantics; I see it as a distortion of what the man said and meant. Typical CNN bull crap.
 
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