[Blood Trail 13]

Wanted to open up some dialogue sparked by a Facebook post I saw today. What are you required to do if stopped by a WCO? I was stopped last year at my vehicle parked on private property. I wasn't hunting. My weapon was inside my vehicle, out of sight of the WCO. He pulled onto private property as soon as he saw my truck parked there. He asked where I was hunting and I said I wasn't out hunting yet today since it was raining. He proceeded to ask for my hunting license. I got my zip lock bag that contains my license and permission slips. I went to open the bag and hand my license however he wanted to go through the whole bag! He proceeded to read all of my permission slips...that's none of his business.

Was I required to let him read all the documents in the bag?

 

[casey]

https://pagamecommission.wordpress.com/2014/08/21/what-to-do-when-approached-by-a-game-warden/

 

[casey]

What to Do When Approached by a Wildlife Conservation Officer


Each year Pennsylvania wildlife conservation officers (WCOs) check thousands of hunters, trappers and game land users for compliance with wildlife laws. These officers enforce laws intended to keep people safe, protect personal property and conserve Pennsylvania’s wildlife resources.

A compliance check by a wildlife conservation officer is an opportunity for outdoor enthusiasts to have positive interactions with officers while in Penn’s woods. Officers can explain laws and describe outdoor opportunities and conditions in the surrounding area.

These are things that you can do to help ensure your experience with an wildlife conservation officer is a positive one:

While Hunting:

Wildlife conservation officers check hunters for firearm safety and compliance with hunting regulations. When approached by an officer, you are expected to follow all basic firearms handling rules.
◾DO NOT attempt to load or unload your firearm while being approached by an officer.
◾Point the muzzle of your firearm in a safe direction away from the approaching officer.
◾Make sure your safety is on. Keep your finger away from the trigger.
◾Comply with all instructions directed to you by the officer.

While Driving:

Wildlife conservation officers may stop motor vehicles at checkpoints used for gathering statistics and enforcing wildlife laws. In addition, officers have the authority to stop motor vehicles for violations observed on Pennsylvania’s highways.

An officer may direct a stop of the vehicle either by signaling a stop with a body gesture or through the use of emergency lights and/or siren. Wildlife conservation officers will identify themselves while in uniform or by providing a badge or state law enforcement officer credential.

When signaled to stop by a wildlife conservation officer please do the following:
◾As soon as safely possible, bring your vehicle to a complete stop and allow the officer to approach you. Failure to stop for an officer may result in criminal prosecution, significant fines and arrest.
◾Be courteous and follow any directions given by the officer pertaining the vehicle inspection. Your cooperation will expedite the inspection process.

You can help make your interactions with wildlife conservation officers positive by having a courteous attitude. By promptly complying with all requests as directed by the officer, you can help ensure a safe, pleasant and productive experience. You can also take advantage of the opportunity to ask the officer for advice and valuable tips.

-This text has been adapted from Warden Courtesies with permission from the Maine Department of Inland Fisheries & Wildlife.

 

[Black Labs]

I've hunted for over 60 years and have been checked by a WCO maybe 4 times and it has always been a pleasant experience.

 

[Potter Co. Joe]

Wanted to open up some dialogue sparked by a Facebook post I saw today. What are you required to do if stopped by a WCO? I was stopped last year at my vehicle parked on private property. I wasn't hunting. My weapon was inside my vehicle, out of sight of the WCO. He pulled onto private property as soon as he saw my truck parked there. He asked where I was hunting and I said I wasn't out hunting yet today since it was raining. He proceeded to ask for my hunting license. I got my zip lock bag that contains my license and permission slips. I went to open the bag and hand my license however he wanted to go through the whole bag! He proceeded to read all of my permission slips...that's none of his business.

Was I required to let him read all the documents in the bag?

I've only been stopped 2 times in many years of hunting.
I also had no issues, but what this WCO did wouldn't have Sat well with me.
He was not called there for any suspicious behavior so checking your license and ID is fine but no need to go through your bag.
I would not have allowed it.
Just a matter of Principal.

 

[Blood Trail 13]

That is the post I saw on facebook. Thing is, I wasn't hunting nor driving. I was parked on private land and didn't even have any weapon on my person or visible to anybody.

I didn't get cited or warned for anything, but I would love to know how this was in the rights of the WCO to stop me.

 

[DIYASUB]

That is the post I saw on facebook. Thing is, I wasn't hunting nor driving. I was parked on private land and didn't even have any weapon on my person or visible to anybody.

I didn't get cited or warned for anything, but I would love to know how this was in the rights of the WCO to stop me.

That falls under the "Open Fields Doctrine" which basically says that if you're in view a leo can check you even if it's private property.

(Google Open Fields Doctrine for a better explanation)

 

[dpms]

Hopefully, since this forum is moderated by a retired WCO, he can tell you exactly when a field check is appropriate and what your rights are during a field check by a conservation officer in Pa.

 

[casey]

That is the post I saw on facebook. Thing is, I wasn't hunting nor driving. I was parked on private land and didn't even have any weapon on my person or visible to anybody.






I didn't get cited or warned for anything, but I would love to know how this was in the rights of the WCO to stop me.

That falls under the "Open Fields Doctrine" which basically says that if you're in view a leo can check you even if it's private property.

(Google Open Fields Doctrine for a better explanation)

DIYA you are 100% correct about this falling under the Open Fields Doctrine.

 

[casey]

http://caselaw.findlaw.com/pa-supreme-court/1237901.html

 

[outofstater]

I was reading this on fb also. I didn't know they was aloud to pull you over. I knew on game lands they could but didn't know on regular state or township roads. Years ago in my part of Pa. 2 dep. was stopping traffic in a very dark and rural area on my way home from camp around 7pm. They was very un professional how they did it by having a fusey burning on road and stood in road directing me to pull over. I did and actually knew the one he was cool but ti thought it was very dangerous how they did it. Second of all they had carhart bibs on over there uniforms and just introduced them selves who they was. 2 things I thought was bad they could of been easly hit and killed the way they did it. On the other hand with no state marked vechicle with out flashing lights I think I really would not of had to stop or I could of had my gun loaded for protection not knowing what was going on. The situation kind of bothered me since we lost a good man the year before with my fire company, he was directing traffic after dark when a car hit and killed him. This was around 1995 I hope for the safety of these men a system was put in place of how to properly stop traffic.

 

[Goosehunter]

While Waterfowl hunting I've been checked umpteen times over the years. Numerous times the WCO not only went thru my bag but searched the area around where I was hunting.
They're always looking for things like lead shot, over the limit birds etc.
Never gave it a 2nd thought as it seemed like a good plan to check everything in my possession.
When waterfowl hunting with decoys you are easily visible from a distance, the WCO used to wear camo and sneak up to our location. Then jump out and surprise us. Course many times we'd see him coming and act surprised.
We'd always ask him if he brought the donuts along!

 

[R. S. B.]

Hopefully, since this forum is moderated by a retired WCO, he can tell you exactly when a field check is appropriate and what your rights are during a field check by a conservation officer in Pa.

The powers and duties of Conservation Officers can be found in this section of the law.

http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legi...iv=0&chpt=9

ALL officer inspections and searches are still bound by the rights granted in the Constitution and also opinions of the high courts. But, since hunting is a highly regulated activity the courts have ruled that administrative stops and checks of licenses and hunting bags by Conservation Officers will not be held to the same standards and restrictions as some other law enforcement contacts.

Dick Bodenhorn

 

[Laylow]

I always said officer says hands up - hands up. Officer says sit down - sit down. Officer says show your hands - show your hands. But I did have a WCO check my Ithaca Model 51 for a plug and he didn't know how to load and check it. I said don't shoot me and I won't shoot you and I'll load it for you.

 

[TrashPanda]

I have not been checked by a WCO very many times in PA. I have been checked more in other states - namely New York, Montana and Alaska. None of the encounters I've had have been unpleasant. Almost all were cordial and quick.
The only "problem" I ever had was with a trainee who was doing a ride along with the regular WCO. It was the trainee who checked me on the last day of flintlock season. I had harvested a buck in archery season, but still had a doe license for the unit that I was hunting in. For some reason, the trainee was insistent that I should still have my buck tag to be hunting that day. I explained to him several times that since I had gotten a buck earlier in the year I had to tag it and I no longer had the tag. After several exchanges, he went to speak to the WCO and showed him the tags that I had in my possession. After a brief conversation, the trainee returned to me, said I was good and wished me luck.
Wasn't a real big deal as I knew I was legal. Just wasted my time a little and I was surprised that a WCO trainee at that point of training didn't know the regs. But I guess that is part of why he was doing the ride along.

To the OP though, if you have nothing to hide from the officer, who cares what they want to look at?

 

[DennyF]

I went to open the bag and hand my license however he wanted to go through the whole bag! He proceeded to read all of my permission slips...that's none of his business.

With the new reg banning possession of expired licenses, I expect there will be far more interest in what's in there with the current license.

If you had a permission slip for the property you were parked on and it is enrolled in some sort of PGC public access program, then he might've been happy to have noted that?

Have probably been through a half dozen or so interactions in the field with WCOs and DWCOs over the past 55 years. Most were not a problem.

Although some of them were a tad too snooty to suit me. But everyone has their own way of doing their job and I'm fairly flexible when it comes to dealing with the less than personable among us?

 

[spunky]

I had a normal year last year only stopped 4 times. I really like to mess with the deputies when I hunt during deer season for ducks.. Have had them try to fine me for not having orange on. Let's see , I have a deer cart full of decoys, a string of calls on my neck, a semi auto shotgun and I'm in full camo. And I have ducks hanging from my strap. Twice they had to call higher ups to see if ducks were in season. I do wear an orange vest and hat when walking to the car but not in the blind.

 

[twistedoak]

cut the WCO a break ,90% of people here would be lost with a Ithaca M51.
Ive never been stopped by a WCO and I've hunted off and on for 35 yrs.
kind of glad I did read this tho because my first thought would be to unload my shotgun and make it safe

 

[Blood Trail 13]

To the OP though, if you have nothing to hide from the officer, who cares what they want to look at?

I didn't want him seeing all of the permission slips. That is none of his business. Plus, I wasn't hunting. I don't need random searches of my bags on private property from a WCO when I am not even hunting!

 

[bohunr]

the WCO had to have "probable Cause" or your "consent" to go thru that bag.

(7) Search any person or means of transportation or its attachment or occupants, or any clothing worn by any person, or any bag, clothing or container <span style="font-weight: bold">under probable cause, consent,</span> exigent circumstances or other established exceptions to warrant requirements, provided that if any person is present the officer presents a badge or other means of official identification and states the purpose of the search.