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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
MEMORANDUM
Posted: February 11, 2013 02:49 PM
From: Representative Gerald Mullery

To: All House members

Subject: Defining Game Commission Enforcement Officer


In the near future, I will reintroduce former House Bill 2102 of 2011, which would amend Title 71( State Government) of the Pennsylvania Consolidated Statutes, in retirement for State employees and officers, further defining "Enforcement Officer".

Please consider co-sponsoring this legislation to include Enforcement Officer in the commissioned law enforcement personnel employed by the Pennsylvania Game Commission who have and exercise the same law of enforcement powers as Game Commission Officers.
 

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These gov't pension plans are what is going to kill the USA, and it will be sooner than later. Nothing will be done about it because all of the legislators are eating from the same trough.
 

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This bill makes no sense since WCO are aleready in the state retirement system. The only thing I can think of is he is talking abiout deputies, who are not employes but volunteers.
 

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TusseyMtMan said:
These gov't pension plans are what is going to kill the USA, and it will be sooner than later. Nothing will be done about it because all of the legislators are eating from the same trough.
Yep. Especially when the ride can begin at such a early age. Been into it before here. The argument will be made that these jobs are dangerous and stressful and demand exceptional physical ability which wanes with age. Sorry, there are much more demanding, stressful and dangerous jobs everywhere with no pensions or benefits. And, we are know what we are getting into when we choose our career path.

Nothing against wcos. Just some general comments directed at our countries tremendous weight of public sector pension plans that are crushing the taxpayers.
 

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[/quote]
Yep. Especially when the ride can begin at such a early age. Been into it before here. The argument will be made that these jobs are dangerous and stressful and demand exceptional physical ability which wanes with age. Sorry, there are much more demanding, stressful and dangerous jobs everywhere with no pensions or benefits. And, we are know what we are getting into when we choose our career path.

Nothing against wcos. Just some general comments directed at our countries tremendous weight of public sector pension plans that are crushing the taxpayers. [/quote]

Sounds like the argument a rejected candidate makes. Long on emotion short on facts.
 

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Yep. Especially when the ride can begin at such a early age. Been into it before here. The argument will be made that these jobs are dangerous and stressful and demand exceptional physical ability which wanes with age. Sorry, there are much more demanding, stressful and dangerous jobs everywhere with no pensions or benefits. And, we are know what we are getting into when we choose our career path.

Nothing against wcos. Just some general comments directed at our countries tremendous weight of public sector pension plans that are crushing the taxpayers.[/QUOTE]

Sounds like the argument a rejected candidate makes. Long on emotion short on facts. [/quote]

Please present some for me to look at. Most dangerous jobs, most stressful jobs, jobs that require the greatest fitness levels. Also any information on public sector pension plan solvency along with possible burdens on the taxpayers.
 

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No agency at any local, state, or federal government should have any form of pension plan that is funded by taxpayer dollars. Private companies can do as they wish with their money, but when it comes to taxpayer money it's a whole new ballgame.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Might have more to do with the retirement age one can retire at than anything else. Our WCO's do not have the 20 and out option.

Ask our resident retired WCO's to explain the current system.
 

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PA Game Commission WCO's do not have an early L.E.Retirement. Current retirement is 65. Retirement is not contribution free. In fact most WCO's have deferred Compensation accounts, 100% funded by the employee.
 

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GRock said:
No, none for any state employee. Our tax dollars should not go for that.
So your saying that no state employee should have a retirement?
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Ok, so what should these folks do for retirement? The anti goverment rant only goes so far. There is a need for government employee's.

I do agree though, the pensions for some - not all have gone to far.

Some - investigate beyond the headlines or the politician / party love fest. Not everything is equal. Some government employees (state level) have reasonable private sector compatible retirement plans. others have what is in the headlines.
 

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Problem is that not all law Enforcement entities have a 20 or 25 and out system of retirement. There's no reason to keep law enforcement personnel hanging on until they are 60-65 in their current job. For one, their physical skills are greatly diminished which is a danger not just to themselves but to their fellow officers. My wife spent 30 years in LE. When she was offered retirement we jumped at it. Not only does your physical ability diminish, but every year new laws and added bureaucrats make doing your job harder and harder.
 

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R.W.J said:
GRock said:
No, none for any state employee. Our tax dollars should not go for that.
So your saying that no state employee should have a retirement?
Yeah, a 401K....not taxpayer funded pension and healthcare plans for the rest of their life...especially when these pension plans end up paying out more than the employee paid in.

Not knocking WCO's in the least bit. It's just that these bloated pension plans are out of control.
 

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stackbarrel said:
Not only does your physical ability diminish, but every year new laws and added bureaucrats make doing your job harder and harder.
As is the case with many jobs in the private sector. Public sector's retirement and pension plans should mirror the norms in the private sector. They do not and it is the taxpayer that struggles to keep them solvent.
 

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Originally Posted By: dpmsOriginally Posted By: pappybear
Yep. Especially when the ride can begin at such a early age. Been into it before here. The argument will be made that these jobs are dangerous and stressful and demand exceptional physical ability which wanes with age. Sorry, there are much more demanding, stressful and dangerous jobs everywhere with no pensions or benefits. And, we are know what we are getting into when we choose our career path.

Nothing against wcos. Just some general comments directed at our countries tremendous weight of public sector pension plans that are crushing the taxpayers.

Sounds like the argument a rejected candidate makes. Long on emotion short on facts. [/quote]

Please present some for me to look at. Most dangerous jobs, most stressful jobs, jobs that require the greatest fitness levels. Also any information on public sector pension plan solvency along with possible burdens on the taxpayers. [/quote]

Your original post was all opinion and provided no facts of your own.

I have no doubt that there are other occupations that require more strength and physical agility. A reasonable amount of strenght and physical agility is required to perform most LE jobs. There are also jobs that produce more stress, even though, LE is still listed in the top ten of stress producing jobs. And yes there are more dangerous jobs, but LE jobs are dangerous. For many years LE jobs were listed as the top 1,2, or 3 in alcoholism, divorce,cardio-vascular disease and suicide. So the dangers are internal as well as external.

Public pension solvency is certainly an issue. Pension plans are being re-negotiated throughout the country for many occupations including many LE agencies.
A lot of the problems have come from improper administation of how pensions are calculated. Earnings based on anything but "base pay" artificially inflate pension payments. You can't pay into a system for 25-30 years at one rate and collect at a rate based on an artificially high last year salary which often includes copious amounts of overtime.
You are right that most people who choose LE as a career path know what they are getting into. That also includes the promise of retirement after 25 or 30 years of service. The current trend of moving new hires to a 457b plan is a good alternative.
Public sector jobs were never meant to be higher paying than private sector jobs. The benefits and pension were always the trade off. Take that away and what will draw qualified candidates to these positions?
 

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dpms said:
stackbarrel said:
Not only does your physical ability diminish, but every year new laws and added bureaucrats make doing your job harder and harder.
As is the case with many jobs in the private sector. Public sector's retirement and pension plans should mirror the norms in the private sector. They do not and it is the taxpayer that struggles to keep them solvent.
As should their salaries
when that happens, then we can seriously talk about pensions!
 

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A available job will draw them. Don't know about you but every person I personally know employed in the public sector makes a good living in relation to the skill set. Top that off with very good benefits and retirement plans.

No problems with folks making money and being successful. Pay what the taxpayer can afford and offer retirement packages that can remain solvent and that are inline with the private sector.
 

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R.W.J said:
PA Game Commission WCO's do not have an early L.E.Retirement. Current retirement is 65. Retirement is not contribution free. In fact most WCO's have deferred Compensation accounts, 100% funded by the employee.
CORRECTION Retirement is 60 or 35 years of service
 
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