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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: In the Heart of Steeler Country
Since the Gwynn thread isn't about this, I figured I'd make a new one. Guys I think should be there, but aren't:
Bonds/McGuire-NEVER BROKE A RULE!! Illegal if true, yes. Not exactly the first guys to use illegal drugs. Grover Cleveland Alexander, Ruth and Mantle were all alcoholics as well, with Mantle and Ruth getting the added bonus of womanizing. The steroids didn't make them great hitters, either, in fact, in Bonds case, it actually made him a less complete player. A bigger effect of the steroid era, and a much bigger reason for the power surge, was juiced pitchers that had the ability to throw 100 mph, but without pinpoint control. Clemens didn't give up home runs after he hit the juice (allegedly), because he could actually pitch. A Rod is different. It was against the rules then.
Clemens--A tool of a person, perhaps. See Cobb, Ty.
Randy Johnson-5 time Cy young, second in strikeouts, 300+ wins, World Series title.
Shoeless Joe Jackson--all involved with the fix of the 1919 Series unequivocally deny Jackson's involvement. His numbers from that Series don't support his involvement. .356 career average (which is third all time), .375 in the series. Kinda odd numbers for a guy trying to lose. 1700 hits, but in only 10 seasons. Excellent outfielder as well.
I'm not including Rose. He bet on games involving his own team. It was CLEARLY a violation of baseball's rules. I can't say 100% that his lifetime ban is without justification. He knew the consequences. Yes, without the gambling, there is no possible way he shouldn't be in. In contrast to Jackson, Rose created this for himself, he wasn't lumped in with the actions of others by a tyrannical Goodell like commissioner.
We’re not going to apologize for caring. We’re not.