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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 12:03 PM Thread Starter
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Title search question

Was interested in a camp purchase. Called the owner and he said a title search was done looking back 60 yrs and a "glitch" was found. He said they didn't know if the owner at that time is even alive and it would cost 3k to resolve it. He said if a person paid cash for the property should not be an issue, but could be if a loan was sought. Anyone have any experience with this sort of thing. Would it be best just to stay clear of it?

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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 12:19 PM
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Re: Title search question

I just purchased 2 properties and 1 had an issue; during its sale before me the seller did not sign the deed and all it took was a Quit Claim Deed cost me about $1500. I used my attorney to Fix the Title. Most titles can be fixed relatively easy with an attorney who deals primarily in Real Estate Law. A real Estate attorney will usually do a good search for around $150.00 you can also purchase title insurance if that will easy your worries but a bank will want a clean title for a loan

What was the issue and how far back does it date?

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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 03:57 PM
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Re: Title search question

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADKtrapper
Was interested in a camp purchase. Called the owner and he said a title search was done looking back 60 yrs and a "glitch" was found. He said they didn't know if the owner at that time is even alive and it would cost 3k to resolve it. He said if a person paid cash for the property should not be an issue, but could be if a loan was sought. Anyone have any experience with this sort of thing. Would it be best just to stay clear of it?
An attorney can do a quiet title action, which will resolve the problem forever..........it requires advertising in a newspaper for something like 30 days, in the area that the camp is located, as well as the last known location of the previous owner (meaning the guy involved in the "glitch")

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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-23-2014, 04:58 PM
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Re: Title search question

also if the owner of the camp now brought it and closed he should have title insurance which would cover any issues. I deal with this problem every once in a while as a loan officer
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-24-2014, 04:36 PM
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Re: Title search question

Paying cash does nothing to solve the title problem -- only foists it upon you. The seller is saying essentially that someone who is careful (i.e. a lender) wouldn't touch it, but if you don't want to be careful there is a deal to be made. What is the scope of the title problem? Best course of action if you want the land is to tie it up with a purchase agreement that has as a contingency seller's ability to remove the title defect. If you buy it with cash you could risk being unable to resell or refinance it, or, in a worst case scenario, you could lose it all. Quiet title is the way to go, but make sure that there is no way for the seller to be able to sell it to someone else after you've invested money in clearing up his title problem. A good purchase agreement is necessary.
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-25-2014, 01:09 AM
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Re: Title search question

I'll guess what probably happened was some type of forced sale. (tax sale, sheriff sale, etc. in the properties history. etc. That in itself is not necessarily a deal breaker. Tax and sheriff sales are usually pretty solid if the paper trail exists proving that the owner got proper notice but a quiet title will remove all doubt that the title is clear. An uncontested quiet title shouldn't cost more than $1500-2000 max. A contested one can get ugly if the paper trail isn't solid. You need to find out exactly what the issue is and you need a lawyer representing you and not just the seller, in this purchase if you move forward. On the other hand, if you're not spending a lot of money on the camp, you're not risking a lot and something 60 years old is not very likely to become an issue now. It WILL be an issue with a bank if you ever plan to do a true mortgage.

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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-25-2014, 01:29 AM
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Re: Title search question

Been there many many times. ANYTIME a seller says " Don't Worry", Or "Little Glitch " beware. Especially if you pay cash, you get left holding the bag.
A sheriff sale in Finite. You buy it from the county, you get a clear title.
There are a gazillion things that can pop up. Recorded title are in every courthouse back to the counties inception. Going back 50 or 60 years is not enough.

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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-25-2014, 09:27 AM
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Re: Title search question

Just signed a gas lease and the drilling co said I get paid as soon as they complete their<span style="text-decoration: underline"> 150 </span>year search.

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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-25-2014, 11:59 AM
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Re: Title search question

Gas exploration outfits are usually pretty thorough. They have to be, because they don't like getting "stuck" when the person they're dealing with doesn't own the OGM rights.

When Marcellus Shale operations were beginning, I stopped at the Tioga Co. courthouse one day and there were dozens of people going over titles/deeds. Don't think there was one empty chair at any of the table areas? Clerk said they were all searching titles/deeds in order to contact land owners about gas leases.

When I was offered an attractive gas lease several years ago, the title search turned up that those gas rights on my camp property had been sold in the 1930s to a company that no longer exists (as of 2010).

But I was informed that trying to regain my gas rights could cost thousands of dollars in legal fees, because they may have been transered to another company in the process of the original gas rights holder's demise.

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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 07-25-2014, 06:26 PM
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Re: Title search question

Quote:
Originally Posted by DennyF
Gas exploration outfits are usually pretty thorough. They have to be, because they don't like getting "stuck" when the person they're dealing with doesn't own the OGM rights.

When Marcellus Shale operations were beginning, I stopped at the Tioga Co. courthouse one day and there were dozens of people going over titles/deeds. Don't think there was one empty chair at any of the table areas? Clerk said they were all searching titles/deeds in order to contact land owners about gas leases.

When I was offered an attractive gas lease several years ago, the title search turned up that those gas rights on my camp property had been sold in the 1930s to a company that no longer exists (as of 2010).

But I was informed that trying to regain my gas rights could cost thousands of dollars in legal fees, because they may have been transered to another company in the process of the original gas rights holder's demise.

Worth the time to investigate that. better, you can do it yourself at the local court house. Of course, once you find where the OMG rights are or are suppose to be - legal counsel should be sought. But the leg work in the courthouse can be done by anyone that can think and follow a trail.

The downside of doing the court house stuff is you run across all sorts of documents from long ago that grab your attention. Some of the more original documents are almost works of art at times with the script and border art.

Is your position a short term gain - or a long term loss? Separate the issues.
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