Identifying Large Cold Spots - The HuntingPA.com Outdoor Community
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-04-2014, 12:14 PM Thread Starter
The Man
 
Goosehunter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Schoeneck, Lancaster County
Posts: 6,463
Back To Top
Identifying Large Cold Spots

Our Camp in Grugan Township, Clinton County falls into one of these cold spots. It's possible we only have 3 deer per square mile!
Within the Sproul State Forest, our camp is surrounded by Bucktail State Park Natural Area, along the West Branch of the Susqy. No logging will ever be done. The forest just goes on and on, no agriculture for miles. Steep rugged mountains, poor soil and darn few deer.

How big are these cold spot areas? My guess is these are huge areas that will never again support many deer.


"In another fairly stunning move last week on the deer-management front, Robert Schlemmer, president of the commissioners' board, and Commissioner Dave Putnam both talked about identifying large deer-population "cold spots."
Places within individual wildlife management units where deer numbers are low, in comparison to surrounding country.
In the past, hunters have simply been told by deer managers ó in essence ó every WMU has areas with lots of deer and areas with less deer. What matters most is that the unit goal is met.
That can be a tough pill to swallow when your camp is in an area with low deer numbers and you hear the PGC wants to increase the doe kill for your WMU next season.
"In looking at the large cold spots, I think what we have to look at is what can we do, and what can't we do," Putnam said.
He added later, "I think we have to identify the areas, and, maybe there's nothing we can do there. But if that's the case, I think we need to say that."
Putnam said he knows there are large swaths of Pennsylvania's mountains where the forests are mostly mature, and therefore offer little to deer in terms of food.
"We've got very large areas out there with very little food for deer...," he said. "I think we need to identify these large cold spots and maybe accept the fact that they're only going to have three, five or seven deer per square mile."
Such a place is Sproul State Forest in parts of Clinton and Centre counties, according to Putnam.
"And pretty much everything contiguous in northern Centre and Clinton counties," he said.
While there may be little the PGC can do about changing the habitat so that it can hold more deer ó it can't force the state Department of Conservation and Natural Resources to cut timber on state forest, for example ó the PGC can address cold spots through doe-tag allocations.
"We could lower the allocation for the unit, and address the hotspots with the DMAP program," he said.
DMAP ó deer management assistance program ó enables landowners to manage deer on their lands to meet their needs by affording them extra doe tags above and beyond those allocated for their WMU. DMAP tags can only be used on the lands for which they are issued.
Commissioner Jay Delaney noted the board last year did exactly what Putnam talked about.
WMU 3B, which Delaney represents, has the second-lowest deer density in the state at about 13.9 per square mile.
"It's the only unit that I consistently get complaints about the herd being too low," he said.
Delaney successfully lobbied his fellow board members prior to last season to lower the doe-tag allocation for WMU 3B, while then encouraging landowners in the unit that felt they had too many deer to utilize DMAP to address their problems.
"We tried it last year, but I don't know that we'll see the results until next year or the year after that," he said.
Putnam and Schlemmer gave no timetable for when the board will present a list of the state's deer-population cold spots."


Large Deer-Population Cold Spots

I've spent most of my money on Waterfowling, Women and Whiskey.
The rest of my money I just wasted.
Goosehunter is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-04-2014, 12:23 PM
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Northern New York
Posts: 1,197
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

pray for divine intervention. In the Adirondack Forest Preserve, many of the areas have not been cut for between 50 and 120 years. The only times that some of those areas have a bump up in population is when we have a large microburst, hurricane or ice storm. Then the population goes up until the forest canopy closes up again.
Farflung is offline  
post #3 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-04-2014, 03:39 PM
RIZ
Diehard Outdoorsman
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: butler county, pa
Posts: 2,803
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

I don't see the need to spend that kind of resources id'ing places where there are no deer. talk to any hunter in the area and they will tell you. doing a study and publishing results only lets the hunter to say, "I told you so"

RIZ
RIZ is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-04-2014, 09:16 PM
Diehard Outdoorsman
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: PA
Posts: 3,200
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

I'd like to see unlimited private land tags for every WMU and SFL and SGL managed via DMAP only. This would solve the cold spot "problem".

Iím a great believer in luck, and I find the harder I work the more I have of it.
bigbear is offline  
post #5 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-05-2014, 12:05 AM
Diehard Outdoorsman
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: 4D - valley of the bad wind
Posts: 2,568
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

Hunt the good habitat.

It's a good spot. Just not today.
hightine is offline  
post #6 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-05-2014, 12:30 AM
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Elk County
Posts: 13,106
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

Reducing the harvests in the cold spots isnít really going to increase the deer numbers there though. The reason there arenít many deer in those areas is because the habitat is so poor for one reason or another and thus more deer canít be sustained in those cold spots. By lowering the allocation all you are doing is increasing the deer numbers in the areas that arenít already cold spots and running the risk of adding enough deer to those areas that habitat gets damaged there so it too becomes a future cold spot.

Everyone is eventually going to have to face the fact that some areas donít have many deer, shouldnít have many deer and are simply never going to have many deer.

Dick Bodenhorn
R. S. B. is offline  
post #7 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-05-2014, 01:10 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: 2A-Wash. Co.
Posts: 16,185
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

Quote:
Everyone is eventually going to have to face the fact that some areas donít have many deer, shouldnít have many deer and are simply never going to have many deer.
Never... is a long time. The echo of a chainsaw resonating through those same forests can do wonders for "cold spots", as we all already know. PA is a rich state when it comes to hardwood forests. And the beauty of forests, they are RENEWABLE given the correct management. If you ask me, PA doesn't utilize this resource enough (not enough cutting), between the preservation organizations, and our state agencies having a cut rotation that is basically on a 100 year rotation........ if that

2A-Wash. Co.
Fleroo is online now  
post #8 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-05-2014, 11:49 AM Thread Starter
The Man
 
Goosehunter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Schoeneck, Lancaster County
Posts: 6,463
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

It wouldn't matter if the doe tags were lowered or raised, the hunters have left this huge cold spot.
An example would be our camp. Back in the 70's & 80's we had 25 hunters, a cook and a helper cook for the whole first week. We put on drives, hunted from treestands, still hunted and killed a bunch of Buck. The 3 day doe season was an all out war.

Now the last 6 years there has not been one hunter at our camp for the rifle opener. I never would have believed this could happen, but it did. I've not deer hunted for one minute these last 6 years, waterfowl's my game.
Most camps around us have also dwindled down to no hunters during rifle season, there never were many archery hunters.

I miss the old days at camp but no complaining from me or the rest of the members. The deer hunters now hunt close to home in Lancaster county.
A couple of our members have hunted during the 2nd week of rifle season, they get excited if there are a few deer sighted in a whole week of hunting.
It's over, not because of any overharvest, it's just the end of an era.

I've spent most of my money on Waterfowling, Women and Whiskey.
The rest of my money I just wasted.
Goosehunter is online now  
post #9 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-06-2014, 12:56 AM
Senior Member
 
jimbridger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: kunkle, pa
Posts: 16,249
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

Quote:
Commissioner Jay Delaney noted the board last year did exactly what Putnam talked about.
WMU 3B, which Delaney represents, has the second-lowest deer density in the state at about 13.9 per square mile.
"It's the only unit that I consistently get complaints about the herd being too low," he said.
Delaney successfully lobbied his fellow board members prior to last season to lower the doe-tag allocation for WMU 3B, while then encouraging landowners in the unit that felt they had too many deer to utilize DMAP to address their problems.
"We tried it last year, but I don't know that we'll see the results until next year or the year after that," he said.
I guess we will see. But on another thread I pointed out that 3B was low and now it seems the PGC agrees.

I think the term "cold spots" was made up by unified to suggest the term "hot spots used by the PGC has to have an opposite.
We always had areas that had more deer than other areas and we also had areas that held less deer than other areas. It seems to reason if HR done it's job both areas should have less deer than before. If it helped in the hot spots it can't hurt in the so called cold spots because there always was a reason there were less deer. Mostly habitat that includes food and cover. Waugh!

AR is only a pacifier.You will never grow if it's not in your genes.
jimbridger is offline  
post #10 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-06-2014, 01:00 AM
Senior Member
 
jimbridger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: kunkle, pa
Posts: 16,249
Back To Top
Re: Identifying Large Cold Spots

Quote:
Reducing the harvests in the cold spots isnít really going to increase the deer numbers there though. The reason there arenít many deer in those areas is because the habitat is so poor for one reason or another and thus more deer canít be sustained in those cold spots. By lowering the allocation all you are doing is increasing the deer numbers in the areas that arenít already cold spots and running the risk of adding enough deer to those areas that habitat gets damaged there so it too becomes a future cold spot.

Quote:
Everyone is eventually going to have to face the fact that some areas donít have many deer, shouldnít have many deer and are simply never going to have many deer.
Dick Bodenhorn
See Dick we can agree. Waugh!

AR is only a pacifier.You will never grow if it's not in your genes.
jimbridger is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The HuntingPA.com Outdoor Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome