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post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-14-2010, 11:46 PM Thread Starter
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ackley lmproved

ive always read about guns chambered a.i. but i dont really know that much about it.can any gun be rechambered,bolt, lever,etc.do you have to reload ammo for these rounds,how much does it cost to convert a gun,and is it worth the money.
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post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 12:11 AM
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Re: ackley lmproved

Any gun can be re-chambered. Typically you only see it with bolt actions because of strength and accuracy. I'm not aware of any commercially available ammunition for a “wildcat” round such as the AI. How much does it cost? If you’re spending the money to re-chamber, one would think you’re replacing the barrel. Kreiger, Broughton, Bartlien, Hart’s all run about $300, some as much as $400, Gunsmith bill for a chamber job runs about $200. At this point you might as well true up the action and lap the lugs, glass bed the action, get some trigger work done, all this can run another $400 to $700 depending on how extreme you go. Custom sizer die add about another $70. Now you ask the question is it worth it? Every darn cent if you ask me? It’s all in what you like to spend your hard earned money on. If someone told me a BMW was worth $20k more than a Chevy Camaro I’d tell them they were outta their mind. To each their own.
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post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 12:12 AM
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Re: ackley lmproved

an ackley improved is not considered a wildcat due to you can actually shoot the original factory shell theu it. You have to understand guys like me have the love of the gun. It like a new mouse trap to play with. What the ai's due is make the case larger to hold more powder, yields more velocity = more knockdown power and gaining more range. first you have to take to a gunsmith to re-chamber, he will run a reamer of that imp. caliber in the chamber some what like a drill bit to make bigger to fit that case, headspace, etc. I would only recomend a bolt action for this. Now where the shooter takes over is forming brass for it. 2 methods; say we have the 280 ai now. Take factory amm place round in chamber squeze trigger. now the case is blown out to the new chamber and a fireformed piece of brass most ai's have a 40 degree shouler. #2 take virgin 280 brass work a stiff load out of a manual seat the bullet in lands touch it off again. yields fireformed case. There is another way which i have never done that can be done guys actually take so much of cream of wheat small amount of pistol powder place a patch in it and touch off.
The plus side of an ai is gaining more vel. as i earlier stated and we all have our personel reasons. I dont own one but the 280 ai has been proven darn near as efficient as the 7mm magnum giving close the vel. with less powder. Also than your buying a magnum action, sizing the beltrd cases. i have experience with the 250 ai my self. What i liked i could go this route and have darn near 25-06 vel. out of a short action. I know some guys have the 30-06 ai and get close to 300 whby. vel with out buying whby. brass. Another plus is you can actually shoot factory load of the mother caliber in emergency.
down side: fireforming brass if you want 50 prepped pieces of brass than you have to shoot 50 loaded rounds for preparation to reload. what is bad there say you have a super high vel. ai such as the 22-250 ai which will be hard on barrels, you just wasted x amount of rrounds of barrel life.
so is it woth it? Your choice i have them and enjoy but my hobby is drag racing bullets. In most cases you can gain 300 fps more with the ai. Im currently building a 22 x243 , gave the 22-250 ai good thought but didnt care to waste the barrel fireforming. i have the 250 savage imp. and would do another one very efficient especially if you like a 25-06. dies for ai are more expensive than regular dies. Btw the ackley come from a famous gunsmith and pioneer in calibers name Parker O. Ackley.
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post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 12:21 AM
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Re: ackley lmproved

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunnermhr
Any gun can be re-chambered. Typically you only see it with bolt actions because of strength and accuracy. I'm not aware of any commercially available ammunition for a “wildcat” round such as the AI. How much does it cost? If you’re spending the money to re-chamber, one would think you’re replacing the barrel. Kreiger, Broughton, Bartlien, Hart’s all run about $300, some as much as $400, Gunsmith bill for a chamber job runs about $200. At this point you might as well true up the action and lap the lugs, glass bed the action, get some trigger work done, all this can run another $400 to $700 depending on how extreme you go. Custom sizer die add about another $70. Now you ask the question is it worth it? Every darn cent if you ask me? It’s all in what you like to spend your hard earned money on. If someone told me a BMW was worth $20k more than a Chevy Camaro I’d tell them they were outta their mind. To each their own.
great post the proper way of new barrel and true the action. some gunsmiths and i have a few around me will re-chamber existing barrrrel. a few of us has had great luck taking the 1984 rem 700 classic 250 savage and re-chambering to the ai. the factory rem. barrels have been good to us.
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post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 12:28 AM
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Re: ackley lmproved

"can any gun be rechambered,bolt, lever,etc."
I dont know about "any" gun. If the gun was origanally for the standard round it should have no problem being rechambered for the improved vesion.

"do you have to reload ammo for these rounds"
Yes
The standard round can be fired in the improved chamber.

"how much does it cost to convert a gun"
Depends on who is doing the work. I have seen huge differences in prices for the same type of work from different gunsmiths. I would guess $150 on up. Remember, cheapest isnt always the best, esspecially when it comes to a gunsmith.

"is it worth the money"
Depends on what 0 to 200 FPS is worth to you.

What cartridge are you looking to improve?
Seems like you get the most gain out of the smaller bore diameters.
Somtimes the improved versions dont feed as well as the standard cartridge. So you might also have extra gunsmithing cost's working over the magazine ect.
You might want to call Lester Knipe (Varmit Shop 610-395-8146). He has done some improved rounds for me and he is not to far from you.

Good luck, Tony
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post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 01:29 AM
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Re: ackley lmproved

For awhile I was seeing more 280AIs than 280 Rems.
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post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 01:59 AM
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Re: ackley lmproved

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jericho
For awhile I was seeing more 280AIs than 280 Rems.
i have heard great things about how efficient they are. i have never tried one only because im not a 7mm fan.
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post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 05:42 PM
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Re: ackley lmproved

The Ackley Improved AI is a wildcat. No factory ammo nor chambering available.

The word improved means you can shoot the factory ammo in it. Which isn't accurate but OK and it makes the case then form fired to the AI shape.

An AI improved case is one that was developed by P. O. Ackley. A respected gunsmith having a shop in Trinidad CO. He wrote for Guns and Ammo and shooting times. Now deceased.

P.O. had the cases made with the same shoulder dimensions, so they headspaces properly with thefactory case. T significant thing is to make a generally straight wall case body, this increases powder capacity DEPENDING on the factory case in question.

Factory cases with generally little body have little advantage being AI (regardless of what people say). Factory cases with significant body taper will have significant increase case powder capacity nad therefore more velocity. The 30-40 Krag is the perfect example of a good AI case. The 300 h&H is another cartridge that increases its capacity by the AI process, as it too also has a ot of body taper. And while these were worth wile in 1960s, today one can get a 300 win mag or a 300 rum and get better velocities than with the old AI improved cases.

Most modern cases like the 243, 308, etc have little increase in powder capacity by reducing the body taper. By comparison the 280 AI gives one extra grain o h20 in case capacity. Hardly worth the effort. so one might say, where does the extra velocity come from?? We AI cases are wildcat so there is no real standard and most are loaded above the pressure in the factory case.

Improving (AI) modern factory cartridges generally give about 150 fps or less at the same pressure. each shooter needs to decide if it is worth the extra activity and expense.

AI cartridges were more significant when we did not have all the factory choices we have today. Today if one wants more velocity than a standrd 280, ,one merely buys a 7 mag. and uses the sved $$$ for more ammo to shoot.
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post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 07:34 PM
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Re: ackley lmproved

"Most modern cases like the 243, 308, etc have little increase in powder capacity by reducing the body taper. By comparison the 280 AI gives one extra grain o h20 in case capacity. Hardly worth the effort. so one might say, where does the extra velocity come from?? We AI cases are wildcat so there is no real standard and most are loaded above the pressure in the factory case."

Bingo!!!! well said Harrysigafoo
You can push alot of standard cases 100+ FPS over published velocities, but they would be above "factory" acceptable pressures. Sure I can still open the bolt ect., but still above factory acceptable pressures.

They are cool, but IMO very little to be gained. I did mine just because I wanted something different.

Good luck, Tony
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post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 12-15-2010, 10:35 PM
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Re: ackley lmproved

The biggest advantage to doing the AI treatment to a rifle, is the fact you don't have to trim cases. I abhor case trimming.

I picked up a 243 and a 7mm-08 not long ago, both are getting AI'd. Also got another 7mm-08 that'll get AI'd, and a 270 that may very well become a 280AI in the future.
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